Enterprise Forever

:UK => Programming => Topic started by: BruceTanner on 2018.September.09. 13:42:21

Title: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: BruceTanner on 2018.September.09. 13:42:21
A little taste / tease...

[attach=1]

No promises, still quite a bit of work and testing to do... : Lol:
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: gflorez on 2018.September.09. 14:27:00
These are the best news since 80s.....!
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: Zozosoft on 2018.September.09. 14:37:36
:smt038 :smt041 :smt038
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: pear on 2018.September.09. 14:59:46
Wow :shock:
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: lgb on 2018.September.09. 23:22:27
Go on Bruce, go on! :) :)
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: Ep128 on 2018.September.09. 23:50:09
:smt026
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: Dr.OG on 2018.September.10. 04:52:51
:smt109 Nice! :smt023
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: geco on 2018.September.10. 13:01:12
Coooool !!! :bow:
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: szipucsu on 2018.September.10. 14:08:06
This seems great! What will it be about?
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: Zozosoft on 2018.September.10. 14:18:38
This seems great! What will it be about?
Adding 32 bit LBA sector addressing and FAT16 support.
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: dangerman on 2018.September.14. 23:29:56
Wow! Amazing! :ds_icon_cheesygrin:

I was investigating the EXDOS internals myself recently and wondering what it would take to add FAT16 or FAT32 support.

Brilliant news that it's being worked on...
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: neurox on 2018.September.26. 09:57:11
A little taste / tease...

You, good Sir, are awesome. Carry on the good work! :-)
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: dangerman on 2019.February.16. 12:17:10
Just wondering if there was any news on this exciting project?
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: Zozosoft on 2019.February.16. 13:39:56
Under beta testing :-)
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: BruceTanner on 2019.February.16. 13:49:46
It is on it's way, Zozosoft is kindly helping with some testing, just sorting out a few issues with the new processor speed-independent disk I/O and turbo support. :mrgreen:

I think it is safe to say it is beyond any "show stopping" issues now: FAT-16/32-bit sectors have been working fine for sometime now, it fits into the available ROM space etc. :ds_icon_cheesygrin:

I'll post here when it's ready!

Here is a preliminary specification / manual, everything still subject to change!

Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: dangerman on 2019.February.16. 17:18:48
Amazing news!  And several unexpected bonuses...

Quote
No “bytes free” delay on floppy disks and small/medium volumes

Really looking forward to the release. Thank you! :mrgreen:

P.S. I didn't realise that you had access to the original EXDOS 1.3 sources...
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: BruceTanner on 2019.February.16. 17:35:30
several unexpected bonuses...
It was necessary because when I first did a :dir on a very large but empty disk it took several minutes! :lol: :lol: :lol:

I didn't realise that you had access to the original EXDOS 1.3 sources...
They came from Werner Lindner of Enterprise Gmbh several years ago. Zozosoft managed to arrange the source files and re-assemble them into a byte-for-byte match to the binary 1.3, and lgb hacked his emulator so we could run the Z80 assembler and linker on a modern PC :mrgreen:
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: gflorez on 2019.February.16. 18:13:39
You both have done a giant's job. Maybe you are ...
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: ergoGnomik on 2019.February.16. 18:14:00
Sometimes ... I hate my eyes. I downloaded and read the specification out of curiosity. It was an interesting read. Unfortunately, I found a number of typos, inconsistent memory size annotation and inconsistent indentation and font size of asterisk marked notes. :oops: Have I already said that sometimes I hate my eyes?
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: gflorez on 2019.February.16. 18:22:36
I remember to read on the Werner Lidner thread that version 2.0 didn't add fixes, out of the 6MHz trick,
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: dangerman on 2019.February.16. 18:27:04
Quote from: BruceTanner
lgb hacked his emulator so we could run the Z80 assembler and linker on a modern PC :mrgreen:

Did I understand that right? Are you compiling the sources on a modified Enterprise emulator? Does that mean the original was actually compiled on an Enterprise?
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: gflorez on 2019.February.16. 18:28:37
Your eyes haven't read the "preliminary" word....
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: BruceTanner on 2019.February.16. 18:33:14
Does that mean the original was actually compiled on an Enterprise?
No, but on a Z80 card also running at 4MHz in an original IBM PC, and all from floppy disks. There is a warning in one of the source files that it takes 20 minutes to assemble, but on a modern PC it takes about 2 seconds!
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: dangerman on 2019.February.16. 18:39:16
No, but on a Z80 card also running at 4MHz in an original IBM PC, and all from floppy disks.

The way things used to be!!!

Was that how EXOS and IS-BASIC were written as well?
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: BruceTanner on 2019.February.16. 18:46:53
Was that how EXOS and IS-BASIC were written as well?
Yes, at the end anyway. They might have started on an Apple II with Z80 card which I also remember using (all these Z80 cards were to run CP/M!)
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: BruceTanner on 2019.February.16. 18:48:12
Sometimes ... I hate my eyes. I downloaded and read the specification out of curiosity. It was an interesting read. Unfortunately, I found a number of typos, inconsistent memory size annotation and inconsistent indentation and font size of asterisk marked notes. :oops: Have I already said that sometimes I hate my eyes?
Thank you, hopefully the next version will be less painful! :mrgreen:
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: Zozosoft on 2019.February.16. 19:17:30
Zozosoft managed to arrange the source files and re-assemble them into a byte-for-byte match to the binary 1.3
Also do it for 1.0/1.1/1.2 and 2.0(/2.1). Then there is what I collected about EXDOS version history:
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: Zozosoft on 2022.November.18. 10:17:16
:ds_icon_cheesygrin:
[attach=1][attach=2][attach=3]
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: Lacika on 2022.November.18. 10:33:56
Ez már működik stabilan?
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: Tutus on 2022.November.18. 11:33:16
:ds_icon_cheesygrin:
(Attachment Link) (Attachment Link) (Attachment Link)
:smt038 :smt038 :smt038
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: Trefe on 2022.November.18. 22:04:11
Jól néz ki! :smt038
Ezek a forrásfájlok fenn vannak valahol? Megnézhetőek?
Hatalmas élmény, mikor mikor megértek egy-egy részt belőlük, pláne, ha jól kommentelve van... :ds_icon_cheesygrin:
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: Zozosoft on 2022.November.19. 13:06:42
Ez már működik stabilan?
Ráérsz majd béta tesztelni?

Do you have time for beta testing?
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: John Fante on 2022.November.22. 11:50:17

Do you have time for beta testing?

I have a little time :-)

And no matter what: Great work :)
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: Povi on 2022.November.30. 10:02:37
ez most kezeli a Szergely féle SD-kártya olvasóban lévő FAT32 formátumú SD-kártyákat is?
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: gflorez on 2022.November.30. 13:00:56
I am actually beta-testing it and... YES.... EXDOS3.0 works great on the emulator, both with the emulated SD-Cartridge and with the emulated IDE expansion. It also works perfectly on the real EP+SF3 when used with the new driver that integrates the SF3 USB as a logical drive. And other device that uses EXDOS30 perfectly is the Enterprise FPGA core, thanks to the mastery of Kyp implementing correctly the SD-Cartridge and using the same Roms that genius Zozo provided me for use on the emulator.

On the other side, the firmware of our SD-Readers needs to be updated, because the SDEXT0X.Rom in them  needs to be updated to be compatible with EXDOS3.0, and also because the firmware is fatter and needs more space. A SD-Cartridge has an, until now, unused memory pagination that adds another 64KB(8KBx8) to the cartridge.  Think about it... a pagination inside the normal Nick's pagination...

Complicate task... more if we think that Zozo will add languages and keyboard pre-sets on the SD-Cartridge. 


Now you can have a very big FAT16 partition with all your things on directories without delving with tinny 32MB partitions, and at the same time it makes easier to transfer your files.

The boring side is that it works as good as always... You will not notice any mayor change on your EP behaviour....
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: BruceTanner on 2022.November.30. 13:30:56
But not FAT32 - only FAT16 (but using 32 bit sector numbers) = max 1GB on SD currently, 2GB emulated (and 4GB on a hard disk but not recommended!)

It is possible for a Z80 to handle FAT32, it has been done, but it will not be in EXDOS as a lot of EP compatibility would be lost.

1GB is enough to contain all the EP programs ever written!

gflorez: thank you for beta testing! But please be aware that IS-DOS is currently dangerous to use with EXDOS 3! It needs a fix which is not yet released (I am working on it) - existing IS-DOS could lead to disk corruption! :oops:
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: gflorez on 2022.November.30. 15:12:28
Great work Bruce, and thanks for the advice about IS-DOS.


Yesterday I made 4x2GB partitions on a SD for the FPGA Enterprise core and they seem to work, but I need to do more tests on them.

Again, like with the FAT12 format, Windows fails sometimes to make good FAT16 partitions.
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: Zozosoft on 2022.November.30. 15:44:27
Again, like with the FAT12 format, Windows fails sometimes to make good FAT16 partitions.
I used Minitool Partition Manager when create 4GB FAT16.
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: Zozosoft on 2022.November.30. 15:45:18
Anyway, new EP FDISK coming soon with SF3 support :ds_icon_cheesygrin:
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: BruceTanner on 2022.November.30. 16:33:18
...create 4GB FAT16.
4GB worked for me, but each FAT alone will be 64k :shock: it is a big bite to chew for a little z80. Performance might suffer! :twisted: :lol:
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: Zozosoft on 2022.December.01. 14:09:15
max 1GB on SD currently, 2GB emulated (and 4GB on a hard disk but not recommended!)
Why only 1GB SD?
It is support SDXC, then up to 2TB (32 bit LBA limit, same true for IDE and SF3).
Theoreticaly possible: 21x4GB FAT16 = 84GB Enterprise storage :lol: (Anyway the 21x32MB FAT12 = 672MB also more than 2x enough for all Enterprise programs :lol: )

Only the ep128emu have a limits about VHD sizes, 2047MB both for IDE and SD.

Quick test with 64GB SD:
[attach=1]
[attach=2]
[attach=3]
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: gflorez on 2022.December.01. 15:58:17
Excessive and extravagant!  Largely out of the hopes of the designers....
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: Zozosoft on 2022.December.01. 16:08:52
Totally pointless, but I tried it anyway :lol:
[attach=1]
[attach=2][attach=3][attach=4]
Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: BruceTanner on 2022.December.01. 16:42:51
*** Z80 too tired

Title: Re: EXDOS 3.0
Post by: SlashNet on 2022.December.02. 00:20:04
Totally pointless, but I tried it anyway :lol:

You use wrong HDD. Seagate has EXOS-compatible model. :)