Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.


Author Topic: BoxSoft Mouse Interface (Read 40635 times)

Offline Zozosoft

  • EP addict
  • *
  • Posts: 13529
  • Country: hu
  • OS:
  • Windows XP Windows XP
  • Browser:
  • Firefox 36.0 Firefox 36.0
    • View Profile
    • http://enterprise.iko.hu/
Re: BoxSoft Mouse Interface
« Reply #195 on: 2015.March.25. 11:02:23 »
Today I bought what I wanted at first, three clones of the older Sharp PC827
This is which type?

Offline gflorez

  • EP addict
  • *
  • Posts: 2667
  • Country: es
  • OS:
  • Windows XP Windows XP
  • Browser:
  • Firefox 36.0 Firefox 36.0
    • View Profile
Re: BoxSoft Mouse Interface
« Reply #196 on: 2015.March.25. 12:36:32 »
The K827P.

Offline gflorez

  • EP addict
  • *
  • Posts: 2667
  • Country: es
  • OS:
  • Windows XP Windows XP
  • Browser:
  • Firefox 36.0 Firefox 36.0
    • View Profile
Re: BoxSoft Mouse Interface
« Reply #197 on: 2015.March.25. 13:01:49 »
And the resistors are of 220 Ohm.

Apart of the required 10K and 82K for the DTR line.

I have refused to do any commutation here... the 3.5 jack connector is to re-use the old lead from the Serial port to the Boxsoft adapter.

Offline gflorez

  • EP addict
  • *
  • Posts: 2667
  • Country: es
  • OS:
  • Unknown Unknown
  • Browser:
  • Firefox 36.0 Firefox 36.0
    • View Profile
Re: BoxSoft Mouse Interface
« Reply #198 on: 2015.March.25. 21:45:05 »
Now I see why it doesn't work..... 8.2k, not 82k.

Tomorrow more tests.

Offline gflorez

  • EP addict
  • *
  • Posts: 2667
  • Country: es
  • OS:
  • Windows XP Windows XP
  • Browser:
  • Firefox 36.0 Firefox 36.0
    • View Profile
Re: BoxSoft Mouse Interface
« Reply #199 on: 2015.March.27. 10:45:53 »
I fixed that resistor but the mouse still doesn't receive the STROBE(RTS) signal.

In the real Boxsoft interface the RTS signal pass trough one of the OR gates fixed to ground but I can't understand why. Is it to get exactly 5v necessary for the Neos mouse?

My next test is to check that signal with a multimeter in the real Boxsoft's while executing  OUT 183,2 and OUT 183.0. May be this signal also need to be isolated.

Offline gflorez

  • EP addict
  • *
  • Posts: 2667
  • Country: es
  • OS:
  • Windows XP Windows XP
  • Browser:
  • Firefox 36.0 Firefox 36.0
    • View Profile
Re: BoxSoft Mouse Interface
« Reply #200 on: 2015.March.27. 15:42:36 »
The two resistors drop the voltage from 12v to 3,35v. Then the OR gate raise it to 4,45v, enough to trigger the response of the Neos mouse.

So without the gate I need to reach 5v with only the resistors.

Offline gflorez

  • EP addict
  • *
  • Posts: 2667
  • Country: es
  • OS:
  • Windows XP Windows XP
  • Browser:
  • Firefox 36.0 Firefox 36.0
    • View Profile
Re: BoxSoft Mouse Interface
« Reply #201 on: 2015.March.27. 20:28:37 »
Now I understand why the OR gate. The pair of resistors are a voltage divider(12v to 5v) that works fine for fixed loads, but the Neos adds resistance and some volts. This system can't work without the OR gate, that isolates the two sides.

I will put one more optocoupler to do this job. Here we need exactly 5v or 0v for the STROBE signal and we have them at hand at the controller port.

On the other side this can allow the use of other type of mouses(MSX) with, may be, different capacitances.

Offline gflorez

  • EP addict
  • *
  • Posts: 2667
  • Country: es
  • OS:
  • Windows XP Windows XP
  • Browser:
  • Firefox 36.0 Firefox 36.0
    • View Profile
Re: BoxSoft Mouse Interface
« Reply #202 on: 2015.March.27. 20:31:29 »
Or at the end I can put an OR gate but then it isn't so neat....

Offline gflorez

  • EP addict
  • *
  • Posts: 2667
  • Country: es
  • OS:
  • Windows 7/Server 2008 R2 Windows 7/Server 2008 R2
  • Browser:
  • Firefox 36.0 Firefox 36.0
    • View Profile
Re: BoxSoft Mouse Interface
« Reply #203 on: 2015.March.29. 00:20:59 »
It is only  half Or gate so I can do the same with only a transistor like this:




Offline gflorez

  • EP addict
  • *
  • Posts: 2667
  • Country: es
  • OS:
  • Windows XP Windows XP
  • Browser:
  • Firefox 36.0 Firefox 36.0
    • View Profile
Re: BoxSoft Mouse Interface
« Reply #204 on: 2015.March.29. 18:13:43 »
Ok. This is the theoretical schematic. Tomorrow I will test the real thing if I find that transistor.


Edit: It has been modified. This is the working one.
« Last Edit: 2015.March.30. 23:41:15 by gflorez »

Offline gflorez

  • EP addict
  • *
  • Posts: 2667
  • Country: es
  • OS:
  • Windows XP Windows XP
  • Browser:
  • Firefox 36.0 Firefox 36.0
    • View Profile
Re: BoxSoft Mouse Interface
« Reply #205 on: 2015.March.31. 00:29:52 »
At last it works!

I've redraw the schematic above. Now it's even more simplistic.....


I was obsessed in getting 5v for the STROBE signal but I've found that it's more important to get the 0v. Precisely because is that state what initiates the reading process.

The Neos still sends movement with only 2,2v and 0v.... But for compatibility with unknown devices(MSX mouses, Arduino adapters, etc) I've managed to reach 4,70v.

RTS unloaded oscillates between 0v and 12v, but with the original Boxsoft(OR gate) it drops to 7,7v. With the present project(transistor) it even drops more to 5,5v... Could it be harmful eventually for the EP? I think not, it is protected inside with a 10K resistor.

I have to do one more test with this "Optoboxsoft" adapter. In the past I have experienced errors of direction with some games when playing with a joystick plugged in Control2 when still connected the original Boxsoft  adapter and Neos in Control 1.

I haven't my joystick at hand... a pity. But it must work(theoretically....).

Also, now is easy to make work an auto-fire joystick on this new adapter. Except for the Fire button moved to pin5 of the D9 connector, it is a real Atari type connector with 0v as common.

No more excuses for not having mouse on the Enterprise with this easy and cheap project.... if you find a Neos mouse on Ebay.

Now I can continue with the Arduino adapter...
« Last Edit: 2015.March.31. 00:51:09 by gflorez »

Offline gflorez

  • EP addict
  • *
  • Posts: 2667
  • Country: es
  • OS:
  • Windows XP Windows XP
  • Browser:
  • Firefox 36.0 Firefox 36.0
    • View Profile
Re: BoxSoft Mouse Interface
« Reply #206 on: 2015.April.03. 10:35:55 »
Today I've found what is wrong with all the MSX related devices, Neos and Boxsoft.....

MSX triggers the reading when STROBE is POSITIVE, and the Neos Triggers when NEGATIVE.

So the Boxsoft adapter can read perfectly one MSX mouse, only the RTS signal must be inverted.


Offline Zozosoft

  • EP addict
  • *
  • Posts: 13529
  • Country: hu
  • OS:
  • Windows XP Windows XP
  • Browser:
  • Firefox 36.0 Firefox 36.0
    • View Profile
    • http://enterprise.iko.hu/
Re: BoxSoft Mouse Interface
« Reply #207 on: 2015.April.03. 10:39:13 »
Wow! Great discovery!

Offline gflorez

  • EP addict
  • *
  • Posts: 2667
  • Country: es
  • OS:
  • Windows XP Windows XP
  • Browser:
  • Firefox 36.0 Firefox 36.0
    • View Profile
Re: BoxSoft Mouse Interface
« Reply #208 on: 2015.April.03. 10:41:29 »
Then, only changing two lines of the Arduino script and now I have the PS/2 mouse adapter working perfect....

I think I can add a switch for MSX or NEOS mode in my OptoBoxsoft....

Offline Zozosoft

  • EP addict
  • *
  • Posts: 13529
  • Country: hu
  • OS:
  • Windows XP Windows XP
  • Browser:
  • Firefox 36.0 Firefox 36.0
    • View Profile
    • http://enterprise.iko.hu/
Re: BoxSoft Mouse Interface
« Reply #209 on: 2015.April.03. 10:42:53 »
OptoBoxsoft....
I like the name! :-)