Enterprise Forever

:UK => Hardware => Interface => Topic started by: Saint on 2013.September.05. 23:33:37

Title: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2013.September.05. 23:33:37
Would it be possible to have an expansion board with a modified exdos rom (to allow boot without wd1770) and driver in the rom for communicating with the sd card?

I have a pic chip talking to an sd card, so creating an interface to the sd card with a cheap pic chip would be quite easy. You'd then just need the driver for exdos.

As getting a disk interface for the enterprise is tricky these days, and disks are unreliable, this seems like a useful project...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2013.September.06. 00:01:20
If you can connect the SD to Z80 I can make EXDOS extension in less than 1 day!
What is needed: Command and Status ports, an LBA sector address port, the number of sectors port, and a 8 bit data port where the data bytes can be continuously read/written.
Commands: sectors read/write and ask card size.
Max continuous transfer 16K (32 sectors)

It is a good idea thinking about a memory mapped I/O. So it would be possible to build the interface as a Cartridge.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2013.September.06. 15:16:39
I've been thinking, and you could combine a memory expansion with an SD card "hard drive". Would just need a ROM on the memory expansion with the EXDOS / driver as well as the PIC interface and a micro sd card.

The only thing missing then would be a way to access the SD card from the outside world. Has anyone written a terminal server for the Enterprise? I could then connect to the client using a USB serial cable to control copying of files to and from the Enterprise "hard drive" as well as perhaps some useful development features like loading and executing code. This could also go into the ROM as an extension.

Having a quick way to remotely access the Enterprise would be very useful.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2013.September.07. 10:49:17
Quote from: Saint
The only thing missing then would be a way to access the SD card from the outside world.
Put the card to PC card reader are the simpliest way :-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: lgb on 2013.September.07. 12:01:05
Quote from: Saint
I've been thinking, and you could combine a memory expansion with an SD card "hard drive". Would just need a ROM on the memory expansion with the EXDOS / driver as well as the PIC interface and a micro sd card.

The only thing missing then would be a way to access the SD card from the outside world. Has anyone written a terminal server for the Enterprise? I could then connect to the client using a USB serial cable to control copying of files to and from the Enterprise "hard drive" as well as perhaps some useful development features like loading and executing code. This could also go into the ROM as an extension.

Having a quick way to remotely access the Enterprise would be very useful.

Well, I always have ideas I don't have time (or enough knowledge ... sometimes) for. I was also thinking to interface with an SD card with an Atmel microcontroller (of cource, someone can play with PIC too). SD (and mmc) cards basically works through SPI bus (well, some cards have other modes too, but SPI is simple, and it works with all, no differences, etc). Most MCUs today have hardware SPI support.  And microchip btw has a full featured Ethernet controller in 28 dip package (!) called ENC 28J60 (I even have one!). This little stuff also "speaks" over SPI by the way! And optionally you can find many other things that can communicate through SPI. So maybe the best would be implement (eg with the help of an MCU) a general SPI interface for Enterprise, then you can have ethernet, SD card, and possible other stuffs as well. Similar (but even more "advanced") idea is to implement an USB host for Enterprise (some more advanced MCUs may handle USB in OTG or host mode too ....), so for example every device which implements the USB mass storage protocol (eg: pendrives, USB/IDE converter, most phones/cameras which does not require own program, card reader) can be used as storage for EP. Also you may be able to find USB/ethernet, USB/serial etc converters. The disadvantage: with USB/ethernet there is no standard way so you may need different drivers for different dongles :(

With SPI/SD card there are tons of examples on the net (mainly with AVR) with firmware/source/schematic. Also I could find tons of examples again for AVR+28J60 and also PIC+28J60. So maybe it's not even too hard to create someting with the help of information can be found on the Net. I will do it some time, just I have no idea _when_ :( Currently I have non-working EP only, first I should cure it ...

If you have some kind of network on the EP, it's possible to write software to be able to handle it. For example in my Javascript based Enterprise-128 emulator I have some stupid experiment to be able to show web pages with implementing some pseudo hardware to bridge information between EP and Javascript AJAX functionality. Of course similar can be done on a real hardware too, just it's more complicated to implement TCP/IP yourself (I did ARP/UDP/ICMP for 6502 once ... it is quite odd to do, but TCP is even  harder). If UDP is OK, it's quite simple to do, and EP will communicate over Internet then if you want :) Just you may need special UDP servers, or you need that TCP/IP monster to be defeated :) Another possibility: Master Zozo post information on some chip here (I can't remember now ...) which implements TCP/IP _itself_ and it's very easy to interface! Maybe that would be fun to try it, but that's a quite odd chip, I have no idea how to buy it. If you have ethernet/networking/whatever once you may not even need SD card, as if you have your home NAS, you may prefer to use it, from your PC and EP too and forget local storage at every level of your life, aka Cloud COmputing. Well, almost ... :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2013.September.07. 15:37:25
Put the card to PC card reader are the simpliest way :-)

But I want an *internal* hard drive for the EP! :) I don't want to have to make a hole in the case for an sd card slot, just have it there unseen and working.

Plus, having a way to quickly send code to real hardware would be really useful for development and testing. I had a similar system on the Atari ST and also Sony PSP which was really nice...

I also have code running on a PIC chip talking to an mmc card over SPI already. Microchip provide some code to do this for you, which is great! :)

The internal memory expansion is really simple, so I'll think about the memory mapped SD card interface too. A generic SPI interface would be possible, but then would require more code on the Enterprise side. I like the idea of keeping the interface simple and having the ability to change the firmware if needed.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: lgb on 2013.September.07. 21:06:52
Quote from: Saint
But I want an *internal* hard drive for the EP! :) I don't want to have to make a hole in the case for an sd card slot, just have it there unseen and working.

Plus, having a way to quickly send code to real hardware would be really useful for development and testing. I had a similar system on the Atari ST and also Sony PSP which was really nice...

Yes, that's the reason I talked about ethernet or USB maybe :) But using an MCU which has some kind of parallel connection with EP bus, has something over SPI still, namely the serial port. You may implement (with some IC like MAX232) a real serial port to interface with a PC (you may need an USB-serial dongle if your PC does not have real serial port as newer ones). The MCU itself works as a "bridge" between SPI - EP bus (SD card for example) or serial - EP bus (PC connection) then.

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I also have code running on a PIC chip talking to an mmc card over SPI already. Microchip provide some code to do this for you, which is great! :)

I suggested AVR for one reason: there are mature projects with AVR and SD card communication, like the sd2iec which is a Commodore floppy "emulator" using SD card for Commodore machines. However the AVR-SD card communication routines can be reused etc and they are widely tested with various SD card in the real life not just from the MCU vendor, that was the reason I suggested that. Of course the PIC vs AVR question is a bit "taste" thing, I prefer AVR, as it has more applications among hobby people, and have more open source tools etc (and I know AVR assembly while PIC assembly looks like horror movie for me), but of course it really does not matter.

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The internal memory expansion is really simple, so I'll think about the memory mapped SD card interface too. A generic SPI interface would be possible, but then would require more code on the Enterprise side. I like the idea of keeping the interface simple and having the ability to change the firmware if needed.

With AVR at least (I don't know about PIC) firmware upgrade can be done easily with so called "boot loaders" even on smaller AVRs like on ATmega8A, or ATtiny series (if I remember correctly). Btw it's not a problem to have more code on the Enterprise side, this is my theory. I dislike the idea a bit to have so much "help" from the outside that someone have more powerfull MCU for the EP than its CPU (z80) is for real. It looks/feels odd for me. I would only use the MCU to interface SPI bus, probably with memory mapped mode though to transfer blocks, but even SD card intialization is controlled by EP, that's the real feeling. At least this is my idea, etc, everyone can have its own ideas what is good and what is not :) For me I may share your idea to keep interface as simple as possible. You can even control SPI bus with "bit banging" without any hw (you can use printer port, whatever). That will be REALLY slow, but it works and it allow to experiment a bit :) MCU here helps to implement SPI by hardware (by the MCU) but it could be even great to have some specialized IC as SPI driver for 8 bit systems :) Like an UART etc, just for SPI.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2013.September.08. 17:15:21
Quote from: Saint
But I want an *internal* hard drive for the EP! :)
Ok :-)
But I think the external solution is enough for most users. I think the cartridge version will be simple and cheap. When it is working it can be sold on the Ebay, as an easy "plug and play" extension, any modifications are not needed on the machine.
Then the tested SD extension can be added as part of your internal project.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2013.September.08. 17:48:13
Is there a problem with using the cartridge for the sd card interface, in that the basic rom would not be plugged in? Or would you think of including the basic rom in the cartridge as well as the exdos / driver rom?

I agree, for other "normal" users a cartridge or expansion port device would be best. I am finding it hard to find 33x2p edge connector (the closest I have found is 34x2p), though. So a cartridge would be the easiest as you can just etch the edge.

An expansion port add-on may be the nicest solution, though... ? I will have to try the 34 way edge connector and see how we'll it fits / how much needs cutting down.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2013.September.08. 18:17:03
Quote from: Saint
Or would you think of including the basic rom in the cartridge as well as the exdos / driver rom?
Yes, the 64K address area enought for all. For example:
-Quick memory test
-BASIC
-EXDOS
-SD driver
The 16K segment of SD driver are divided for example: 0000-1EFFh ROM, 1F00-1FFFh memory mapped I/O, 2000-3FFFh SRAM for work area (then not needed alocate from the machine memory, good for compatibility) (these are example addresses now)

Quote
An expansion port add-on may be the nicest solution, though... ? I will have to try the 34 way edge connector and see how we'll it fits / how much needs cutting down.
50x2 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/2pc-Industrial-Card-Edge-Slot-Connector-50Px2-100P-2-54mm-0-1-3A-200-EDAC-/130918327994?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1e7b5726ba), can be cutted, a the remains can be used for monitor, joystick, etc cable.
36x2 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/5pc-Industrial-Card-Edge-Slot-Socket-Connector-36x2P-72P-2-54mm-0-1-3A-/140888585264?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item20cd9d3430), also need some cutting.

On the expansion side needed to build a 5V power circuit, and full memory access decoding. On cartridge side are +5V ready, and predecoded access signal, only the 64K space needed to decoded to ROM, I/O, RAM.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2013.September.09. 17:26:06
I do like the cartridge idea, as it also means you can use the disk drive to actually develop and test the hardware. If it was simply a stand alone expansion, it would be very difficult to develop the drivers for the hardware.

The only problem I can see is that inserting an un-housed PCB as a cartridge is awkward and there is no support for the PCB in the cartridge bay. This could mean unwanted stress could be put on the cartridge connector and possibly damage it or the cartridge PCB.

I think a final product may be safer / stronger as an expansion board?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2013.September.09. 21:10:48
Quote from: Saint
The only problem I can see is that inserting an un-housed PCB as a cartridge is awkward and there is no support for the PCB in the cartridge bay.
But you can replace the PCB in the Basic cartridge :-) if it was built in the same size.
What about making new cartridge cases with 3D printing later?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: geo1977 on 2013.October.08. 13:05:46
Interesting!!!!!!!!!!  i want one sd interface:lol:
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2013.October.08. 13:12:54
Quote from: geo1977
Interesting!!!!!!!!!!  i want one sd interface:lol:
I will start looking into this after I've got my internal memory expansion done.

Zozo: I've been thinking -- would it be better to make it such that you could select a disk image from the SD card and use the LBA from the disk image, rather than the SD card as whole? Or have both methods, even?

So you could use it with existing disk images, or as a "hard drive". More like the HxC method.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2013.October.08. 13:29:50
I think LBA accessing whole card as hard drive are enought. It is exist a VHD image with (near to) all Enterprise programs for the hard disk users. This is also can be written to the SDCard.
In my existing hard disk handler program just need to replace the drive detect and sector read/write routines for the SDCard routines then job finished! :-D
Later possible make modified EXDOS version which can simulate floppy drives from disk images on the SDCard.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2013.October.10. 11:12:17
Ok, that makes my life easier... :)

If you needed additional functionality it would of course be possible to reprogram the CPLD and PIC to add it in as well.... :ds_icon_cheesygrin:
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: BruceTanner on 2013.October.18. 15:08:36
Here's a really interesting SD card:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Eye-Fi-Connect-Wireless-SDHC-Memory/dp/B003E47XIQ/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1382100891&sr=8-2 (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Eye-Fi-Connect-Wireless-SDHC-Memory/dp/B003E47XIQ/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1382100891&sr=8-2)

An SD card with built in wifi interface! (Other makes/sizes are available if you search amazon for wifi SD card - this is the cheapest at £25)

It's intended for use in digital cameras: you connect your smartphone or PC to the camera wirelessly over wifi and can then copy your pictures off it. So if it was in an Enterprise SD card interface you would be able to copy files to and from it using a PC etc.

I have been contemplating an Enterprise ethernet interface. This would use this module (http://www.wiznet.co.kr/Sub_Modules/en/product/Product_Detail.asp?cate1=&cate2=&cate3=&pid=1028#tab) to do most of the network protocols. I would write an SMB protocol that runs on the Z80 and would allow eg. :NET USE X: \\server\directory to create an X: drive and allow LOAD and SAVE to "X:name" and also "FTP:name" as well as, with a bit of EXDOS modification, :DIR X:. This would probably be the ideal way of networking an Enterprise but it may be that the wifi SD card would be adequate and would certainly be less work if an SD card interface already existed!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2013.October.18. 22:49:50
That's extremely cool! My original idea for the SD card interface was to have it internal to the Enterprise like an internal hard drive and have a way to access the SD card via a serial connection. This is just so much better! Awesome find.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: BruceTanner on 2013.October.18. 23:11:27
Apparently they have linux running on them! There is a discussion about hacking them here (https://forum.openwrt.org/viewtopic.php?id=45820). I must confess I don't understand it all as I'm not a linux expert :(

What a difference 3 decades of tech advances makes!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: lgb on 2013.October.19. 14:49:24
I've realized that an Ethernet interface for EP can be more useful than an SD card. Why? Because it is a bit cumbersome to always exchange SD card between your PC and EP if you want to copy programs, or better: if you want to cross-develope EP stuff on PC and you need to do lots of data transfer. By contrast, if you have an Ethernet solution you can exchange data easily between your PC and with the whole Internet! You can even have some simple protocol (maybe UDP based) to access a disk image so it would be a quite normal disk from the point of view of EXDOS, just like an SD card solution, or Zozo's IDE interface, etc, just through the net. My home router is always switched on and it has an USB port. I usually keep a bigger pendrive in it (but for sure even a PATA/SATA to USB converter is OK with a harddisk, or any NAS like home stuff), and the router can share the storage via FTP or SMB/CIFS. But I can even run a custom little UDP server for EP for example (it runs Linux so it's not a problem at all to do). So the storage is always there via network, to be used even for EP.

Of course the "disk image level" access can be extended later (as Bruce wrote) to access data not so much with EXDOS but via custom protocol like SMB/CIFS with "a little EXDOS hacking" to support eg DIR on it. I wanted the same with my JavaScript EP emulator via AJAX functionality, and I named it as "NetLinkFS", the theory is similar just I wanted to avoid to hack EXDOS and I used different command set like NDIR instead of DIR, but otherwise the idea is similar.

Meanwhile, if you have Ethernet for EP, you can even load programs for the Net, you can even chat on your EP (like my iRC tries) or even sending/receiving email or some limited text based web browser expereince on EP what I've also tried in my emulator, not only accessing a disk image basically, what would be used with an SD card solution.

At first I thought about implementing a general purpose SPI bus. It would be great to access an SD card and also an ENC28J60 ethernet controller (I have that IC). However Bruce idea about that wiznet module (also Zozo mentioned that idea) is better in the sense that it already supports even TCP/IP by hardware and simple integration on the bus system of a 8 bit machine, no need for SPI at all. Also, writing a TCP/IP stack in Z80 assembly for EP would be a larger work (IP fragmentation, and other issues, especially with TCP; UDP/ICMP/ARP level is much more easy, I've already done it for Commodore 64 some years ago), and it would be somewhat memory hungry solution. That module does that for you, don't need to implement basic network protocols by yourself (of course something like SMB/CIFS should be, but it's another question, the basic of these is UDP, TCP ...).
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2013.October.20. 23:30:59
Another thought is to use something like the PIC18F97J60 for the sd card controller chip. This chip has an in built Ethernet mac and phy and Microchip provide a TCP/IP stack. And it's cheap! Could extend the command set which talks to the SD card to include Ethernet as well...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: lgb on 2013.October.21. 02:02:03
Quote from: Saint
Another thought is to use something like the PIC18F97J60 for the sd card controller chip. This chip has an in built Ethernet mac and phy and Microchip provide a TCP/IP stack. And it's cheap! Could extend the command set which talks to the SD card to include Ethernet as well...

I have no idea about PICs only AVRs, but indeed. Some MCUs even have USB (but then USB host or at least OTG would be needed) so in theory, a pin-monster and feature-rich enough MCU can give Ethernet, SPI, USB and even serial connection well other things too if needed like I2C (can be used with eg a little RTC chip to provide real time clock as well). And btw USB - maybe implementing USB storage protocol is even more comfortable than having SD card interface: pen drives, most mobil phones / mp players (which uses the generic storage protocol and not some own one), or even harddisk with USB adapters can be accessed then.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2013.October.26. 14:01:08
I've started looking into the SD card interface some more now, and I've been looking into the ethernet side as well. You can get the ENC28J60 SPI ethernet controller cheaply, and Microchip offer a free TCP/IP stack. So I can have a PIC controlling both the SD card and ethernet hardware.

I have also been thinking it will be better to do this as an expansion port device if I include ethernet, so I can generate an interrupt on packet receipt. I may also map this as an io device rather than memory in this case. Is there an io map for the Enterprise anywhere?

Also, is it possible to do DMA transfers on the Enterprise, such as using the Z8410? I may be able to do DMA data transfer direct from the CPLD...

Edit: On looking further BUSRQ is tied high on the Enterprise. No DMA possible without internal modification... :(
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2013.October.26. 16:35:48
Quote from: Saint
Edit: On looking further BUSRQ is tied high on the Enterprise. No DMA possible without internal modification... :(
Yes it is only posible if the CPU and DMA are in same CPU board and looks a "CPU" for the system. (Or some signals directly connected from the Z80 to DMA)
If my Z180 project will be successful then it is have built in DMA channels :-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: lgb on 2013.October.26. 18:42:50
Quote from: Saint
I've started looking into the SD card interface some more now, and I've been looking into the ethernet side as well. You can get the ENC28J60 SPI ethernet controller cheaply, and Microchip offer a free TCP/IP stack. So I can have a PIC controlling both the SD card and ethernet hardware.

ENC28J60 was exactly my plan too, I've already bought one, but still I haven't had mentionable freetime to try. I've already posted my original plan somewhere (maybe even this topic) to build a general SPI interface for both of SD card and ENC. Just I thought it's more "EP the boss" feeling to do it on EP not in an MCU to do TCP/IP (it's about the feeling to have an MCU more powerfull than the Z80 itself) too and so. But hmm maybe I am wrong here and these are just feelings nothing more :)

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I have also been thinking it will be better to do this as an expansion port device if I include ethernet, so I can generate an interrupt on packet receipt.

AFAIK, dave has a free interrupt source, it has got two external interrupt possibility, one is used for video interrupt (generated by Nick), but the other is free otherwise.

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I may also map this as an io device rather than memory in this case. Is there an io map for the Enterprise anywhere

I've tried to collect them once in my "epbas" project, but it's not detailed enough. In this forum there are some topics with detailed description on various ports, but mostly in Hungarian and anyway it's hard to collect these together. Anyway this is what I have (http://epbas.lgb.hu/result-dist-db.txt) (you should scroll down to the end of the page).

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Also, is it possible to do DMA transfers on the Enterprise, such as using the Z8410? I may be able to do DMA data transfer direct from the CPLD...

Edit: On looking further BUSRQ is tied high on the Enterprise. No DMA possible without internal modification... :(

I think DMA is not so possible, as Zozo told. I thought about an ugly solution to have some dual port SRAM somewhere in the memory map, and both the MCU and the CPU can access it. However it limits the access to this RAM, and also dual port SRAM is a bit expensive, harder to get, and mosly lower capacity (at least what I've found on the net).
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: BruceTanner on 2013.October.26. 20:48:40
If the network access could be over wifi, the whole thing could be internal :)

If “someone else“ was handling the tcp/ip stack I wonder if you could get away with not needing to use interrupts for network access - it would be a lot simpler. At the EXOS level everything is synchronous ie the z80 would always send a request and wait around for a reply, possibly repeated several times. Even if the spare interrupt works at the hardware level, interupts always cause complications for software and there could be problems with anything from extra stack usage causing odd crashes (the network interrupt interrupting the system interrupt or vice versa depending on how the priorities work out) to problems due to the time taken copying a packet from the net h/w to the z80 in interrupt time. You'd only need interrupts if the high level protocol (SMB ?) needs to respond to an asychronously-received packet, and I don't think it will (assuming it's not being a server!).

If the wifi SD cards turn out not to do what we want, another possibility is to implement exactly what we do want and not involve the z80 in the network at all ie. write PIC s/w so you can read and write files to the SD card directly over the network.

If you go for an i/o-based solution check out how the ethernet module I previously posted a link to does it - it's use of an auto-incrementing register (effectively a pointer to the on-module memory) would (I think) allow INIR etc to be used.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2013.October.26. 23:34:57
lgb, I think of the pic controlling the SD card just as the wd1772 controlling the disk access. There's no need to burden the CPU with the details, just get the data to where it needs to be! :)

I'll need to check the api for the tcp/ip stack and see how it all works, but in general I'm not a fan of polled access. But equally I know little of how the z80 handles interrupts, as I'm a 68000 guy, so if it's going to be a pain in the ass, we can stick with polled. :)

It may even be more sensible to have a higher level protocol at the PIC level, if all that is needed is file transfer. I can see ethernet will need more thought! I'll check out existing spectrum ethernet devices and see how they work...

But this should all be pretty redundant if the wifi sd card can provide the file access we want.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2013.October.26. 23:47:35
One quick question on the Dave and io requests - how does the io port get passed to the address bus as a14 and a15 are controlled by Dave? The z80 passes the io port to both a0-a7 as well as a8-a15 I believe. Does Dave pass through the top two bits of the io port?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2013.October.26. 23:58:42
The A14-15 also go through on the paging circuit in IO mode. Then the A14-15 on the System Bus depend of the currently paged segments.
(This is the big problem with the Spectrum Emulator card: for the Spectrum keyboard scan used the top 8 bit of xxFEh port, then the keyboard emulation very buggy with the original ROM. I fixed it with selecting right segments in my enhanced ROM.)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2013.October.27. 00:18:14
The A14-15 also go through on the paging circuit in IO mode. Then the A14-15 on the System Bus depend of the currently paged segments.

Thanks Zozo, that makes sense. Something to be aware of. :)

I've been looking at SpeccyBoot here --

http://speccyboot.sourceforge.net/
https://svn.code.sf.net/p/speccyboot/code/tags/speccyboot-1.5/

There's some nice code for dealing with the ENC28J60 directly from the Z80. So perhaps just an SPI interface and let the z80 deal with it, after all. I'm a big fan of code re-use, as there will be a fair bit of work on that side...

Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: lgb on 2013.October.27. 08:05:16
Quote from: Saint
lgb, I think of the pic controlling the SD card just as the wd1772 controlling the disk access. There's no need to burden the CPU with the details, just get the data to where it needs to be! :)

Well, yes, but your example is not the very same as with disk access. WD1772 does know nothing about the file system itself of course, it only reads/writes blocks from/to the disk, the "higher level" operation (ie: file system, FAT12 in our case) is done by software (EXDOS) by the EP itself. I wanted to same with the ENC: it's capable of sending/receiving ethernet frames (well, even more, as far as I can remember, there are MAC filters, etc, maybe auto-ARP-request-reply as well, but I am not sure on the last one), so here the TCP/IP itself can be thought as the filesystem in case of EXDOS, that it's must be done by the EP (Z80). Well "must be" in the sense of "my feelings" of course it's not compulsory :) And it requires CPU power, memory etc, maybe even more than FAT handling for EXDOS :) As I've written: it's only a "bad" feeling inside me, nothing more. :)

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I'll need to check the api for the tcp/ip stack and see how it all works, but in general I'm not a fan of polled access. But equally I know little of how the z80 handles interrupts, as I'm a 68000 guy, so if it's going to be a pain in the ass, we can stick with polled. :)

I am not sure, interrupts are useful (or can be), but if you can route your interrupt request via Dave, it's easy to enable/disable, like disable in case of polling only mode, but you still give the chance to be interrupt driven if somebody wanna use it later.

But anyway, if you want to use a more complex MCU for EP, there are some having Ethernet controller integrated as well, even without the ENC :) But I am not sure (never tried) if it still requires more external components than with the ENC solution.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2013.October.27. 09:41:36
I'm coming around to the idea of a hardware SPI interface as a solution to this problem after all! Mostly down to cost and complexity. There will be less components required for an SPI interface (and hence cheaper), all code will be running on the Z80, and it will be expandable.

I should be able to offer several slave devices (4-8?), with the unused slave chip selects and SPI bus brought out to some headers for further user expansion.

Lots of potential...

I think I'll look at using a flash EEPROM as well on this, so it can be reprogrammed in software from the Enterprise. Much nicer to have software upgrades. :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2013.October.27. 10:15:10
Quote from: Saint
0I think I'll look at using a flash EEPROM as well on this, so it can be reprogrammed in software from the Enterprise. Much nicer to have software upgrades. :)
I using Flash ROM. The best type which use 12 bit address for programing function for example x555h and x2AAh. MX or AMD 29F040 (or compatible) are right choice.
With this type you can program it when only one segment paged in.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2013.October.27. 15:36:56
I using Flash ROM. The best type which use 12 bit address for programing function for example x555h and x2AAh. MX or AMD 29F040 (or compatible) are right choice.
With this type you can program it when only one segment paged in.

Hmm, interesting. The 12bit unlock sequence chips I can find have 32kb sectors, which doesn't sound ideal, given a rom image is likely to be 16kb. The chips which require the full address for the unlock sequence have a 4kb sector size, which seems better, but you need to access address 5555h, 2aaah and the write address. This would require 3 pages for programming to access all addresses required. Is that a problem? It leaves 1 page available for the programming code, which seems ok... It's not as through flashing the ROM is going to happen often. :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: lgb on 2013.October.28. 14:47:19
Quote from: Saint
I'm coming around to the idea of a hardware SPI interface as a solution to this problem after all! Mostly down to cost and complexity. There will be less components required for an SPI interface (and hence cheaper), all code will be running on the Z80, and it will be expandable.

Well, SD-card, the ENC28J60, but even there are SPI clock chips (yes, master Zozo has clock chip card or so, but maybe not too popular that everyone has it) besides I2C too, and many other even more "odd" devices (DAC and ADC chips, even mp3 playback capable chips!!!!!! - so in theory someone can digitalize audio with EP or playback, even mp3 playback ...) so quite unique features can be done only using SPI. That's why I always wrote too much about this topic, hopefully my writings are more or less survivable :)

For this purpose, for 65xx CPUs there is already a CPLD based solution (well, two versions):

The original version: http://sbc.rictor.org/io/65spi.html (http://sbc.rictor.org/io/65spi.html)

The "B" version: http://www.6502.org/users/andre/spi65b/65SPI-B%20Datasheet.pdf (http://www.6502.org/users/andre/spi65b/65SPI-B%20Datasheet.pdf)

I've just inculded them here (and maybe I've already posted it) because there are somewhat detailed description which can be useful to create something similar for other CPU as well (I am not sure but I guess directly this 65SPI cannot be used because of the symmetric nature of a 65xx - also called motorola - bus that clock signal itself is symmetric and continuous but still controls the memory access as well, on Z80 they are different things), also it seems there are some things offered to be downloaded which can be useful (sorry I have no idea, I don't know anything on CPLD programming ...).

Quote
I should be able to offer several slave devices (4-8?), with the unused slave chip selects and SPI bus brought out to some headers for further user expansion.

Interesting, one of the 6502 forums topics exactly about this, and also the reason that the mentioned 65SPI CPLD solution has two variants ... Also do not forget that some devices are a bit odd (as far as I know!) for example SD card requires to go into SPI mode to pulse CLK about 74 times with select signal UNasserted. That sounds odd for me, as SPI defines that not selected devices shoudl not bother the MISO/MOSI/CLK at all! Also it seems some devices won't release (to high-Z) pins even when unasserted or need more time that you except ... One of the difficulties about SPI that it sounds great and logical but always there are devices which interprets the standard a bit more relaxed. That's OK if you interface only with one device. But if you want to do "shard SPI signals" (for MISO/MOSI/CLK at least, of course different select signals for devices!) you can meet quite "interesting" problems sometimes. But all I know about these are mainly from others' writing (as I was still lazy/etc to start my own project for real!) so please do not treat my words as-is, I can be wrong.

It's also interesting to think abotu SPI modes, I guess mode 0 is enough for most devices, implementing every SPI modes would attract some extra complexity into the design ...

Quote
Lots of potential...

Indeed!

Quote
I think I'll look at using a flash EEPROM as well on this, so it can be reprogrammed in software from the Enterprise. Much nicer to have software upgrades. :)

Yes, there are SPI and I2C based FLASH chips as well with quite great capacity and low price! A parallel bus version of the same are always more expensive ... And while some people blame SPI that it will be slow (because of the serial nature) at the other hand, think again: only 10MHz of SPI clock (which is supported by ENC28J60 as far as I can remember, or hmm even more?) allows 1.25 mbyte/sec. And I guess even a 4MHz Z80 can't even handle that transfer rate, so SPI is totally OK :) Modern SPI cards can even provide higher SPI clocks, etc etc.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2013.October.28. 14:55:51
Quote from: lgb
Yes, there are SPI and I2C based FLASH chips as well with quite great capacity and low price! A parallel bus version of the same are always more expensive ...
But how can you use serial Flash as Z80 memory?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: lgb on 2013.October.28. 14:59:59
Quote from: Zozosoft
But how can you use serial Flash as Z80 memory?

Not directly of course. But anyway, if you have SD card interface (or any other somewhat modern storage to be fast and always accessable), not so much difference, just mentioned.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2013.October.28. 22:26:10
I've done the SPI master interface Verilog code now. I had looked at the 65SPI stuff before, but I seem to remember it was a bit hard to understand the code (I think VHDL, which I'm not a fan of). Luckily Altera had some sample code which is an SPI master controller which interfaces to a standard bus with RD/WR/CE type interface and a bi-directional 8 bit data bus.

Unfortunately though, I don't have that many pins spare on the EPM3064, as I'm looking at the 44 pin version at the moment. So I can only manage 2 SPI slave devices and a 4 page ROM area with one page split into 8KB code and 8KB SPI interface. Is 8KB enough for the SD card driver do you think, Zozo? It may be a bit tight as it will need to be all Z80 code to control the SD card.

It does mean there is a spare line for an ethernet controller, though. :)

The other option is to use a 100pin EPM3064, which is actually cheaper, but will be more difficult to solder. I've ordered some solder paste, so I'll have a practice on some small pitch SOIC's with the hot air rework station and see how I get on. The 100 pin TQFP would be the best option as there will be no problem with running out of pins. Although I am very tight on macrocells with 63 of 64 used atm, so even with more pins I may find it very tricky. Moving up to the EPM3128 suddenly gets a lot more expensive.

One place I can save in pins possibly is MREQ, RFSH, RD and WR. For the SRAM expansion I use MREQ & RD & !RFSH for the chip enable. Looking at the timing diagrams, could I just get away with using RD? If I could get 2 pins back, that would be handy. :)

Edit: looking at the timing again, I need MREQ to differentiate bewteen io and memory request, but not RFSH. So I can get an extra bit back for address decoding, giving 12kb rom and 4kb spi registers in the spi page.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: lgb on 2013.October.29. 09:26:45
Quote from: Saint
I've done the SPI master interface Verilog code now. I had looked at the 65SPI stuff before, but I seem to remember it was a bit hard to understand the code (I think VHDL, which I'm not a fan of). Luckily Altera had some sample code which is an SPI master controller which interfaces to a standard bus with RD/WR/CE type interface and a bi-directional 8 bit data bus.

Ahaa, I see. The only problem I've heard is about the not-so standard SPI bus handling by some devices I've written in one of my previous messages (like SD card etc). So similar devices (maybe even 65SPI "B" version) has not only a separated select signal, but also MISO.

Quote
Unfortunately though, I don't have that many pins spare on the EPM3064, as I'm looking at the 44 pin version at the moment. So I can only manage 2 SPI slave devices and a 4 page ROM area with one page split into 8KB code and 8KB SPI interface. Is 8KB enough for the SD card driver do you think, Zozo? It may be a bit tight as it will need to be all Z80 code to control the SD card.

I don't think you need lots of code to handle an SD card. EXDOS will do all of higher level stuff (like FAT filesystem) you only need to supply SD card detect/initialization, block read/write, and such short piece of codes. I can tell after inspecting some AVR code, that even a little AVR MCU with as little as 4K (or 8?) flash can easily do it, and it also includes some FAT driver (which you don't need at all for EP, because it's task of EXDOS)!  As far as I can do a wild a guess, even about 2K Z80 code is enough in case of the Enterprise! Zozo is much more suitable person to answer this though :) Maybe his IDE card and its ROM can be checked out as a rough guess about needed amount of extra code. It's another question that people not having an EXDOS card itself (like me) would need the EXDOS too (maybe a bit modified version, Zozo told something about the need to remove some WD initialization code which can lead to long delays because of lack of a real WD in the system EXDOS was created originally for - fortunately EXDOS is also a great work having good "layered" design to easily adopt totally different storage hardware if it can support some basic functions like block read/write).

But for Ethernet, the situation is quite different especially if Z80 based TCP/IP stack must be created, but still I would not expect to have much more code than - let's say - some Kbytes (for the protocol itself, but there can be other parts unlike the more generic block level SD card interface for EXDOS ...).

It does mean there is a spare line for an ethernet controller, though. :)

Btw, what do you mean about "8K SPI interface"? Is it some kind of memory mapped stuff? At least my ideas was using simple some I/O ports, I am not really sure what you mean about 8K here. Or is it something I've also written about that some kind of DMA is done to a dedicated RAM (or RAM-like, from the point of view of the Z80 at least) area which can be accessed by the CPU as well, as it would be regural RAM?

Btw, can you suggest some resources (sorry, bit off-topic here maybe) to learn Verilog and/or VHDL? To be honest, I've already tried several times but always I felt lost after some minutes because of the "alien nature" of these hardware description languages compared to ones ("normal" program languages) I am used to.

One thing has crossed my mind though. As far as I know Atmel has FPGA (not CPLD do you can easily reprogram it, I guess) with integrated MCU on it. I don't know but maybe Microchip has something similar too (as far as I can sense you prefer PIC over AVRs, that's why I wrote about Microchip). So you can even save a discrete MCU, and lowering the chip count, if you want an MCU as well not just a CPLD/FPGA.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2013.October.29. 09:46:13
The current size of IDE expansion ROM are 5272 bytes. And needed about 4K RAM area for logical drives (if all possible 21 used (F-Z)).
Originaly I suggested shared ROM/RAM/IO segment for the SD driver, for example, 8K ROM, 8K-256 bytes RAM,last 256 bytes for IO.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2013.October.29. 09:52:57
Quote from: lgb
Btw, what do you mean about "8K SPI interface"? Is it some kind of memory mapped stuff? At least my ideas was using simple some I/O ports, I am not really sure what you mean about 8K here. Or is it something I've also written about that some kind of DMA is done to a dedicated RAM (or RAM-like, from the point of view of the Z80 at least) area which can be accessed by the CPU as well, as it would be regural RAM?

Btw, can you suggest some resources (sorry, bit off-topic here maybe) to learn Verilog and/or VHDL? To be honest, I've already tried several times but always I felt lost after some minutes because of the "alien nature" of these hardware description languages compared to ones ("normal" program languages) I am used to.

One thing has crossed my mind though. As far as I know Atmel has FPGA (not CPLD do you can easily reprogram it, I guess) with integrated MCU on it. I don't know but maybe Microchip has something similar too (as far as I can sense you prefer PIC over AVRs, that's why I wrote about Microchip). So you can even save a discrete MCU, and lowering the chip count, if you want an MCU as well not just a CPLD/FPGA.
I will be using memory mapped I/O for this interface, just because I don't have enough pins to include A0-A7 which hold the port address for the IORQ. Because I only use partial address decoding (A21-A12), I can only decode to 4KB pages (I've got an extra bit back by removing RFSH), so there will be a 4KB window where the SPI registers (4 of them) are shadowed.

The reason I need all the address lines is to decode the address for the on-board ROM as well. Another option would actually be to use a GAL for the address decoding of the ROM, as I do the SRAM expansion, and then use the CPLD just for SPI. This would free up a few pins for additional SPI slave selects, which may be a better idea. I'll have a think about that.

I found the best way to learn Verilog was to buy an FPGA development board (I bought an Altera DE1) and then just start playing around with it! The DE1 has a VGA out, so it's easy to write some simple Verilog code to output some colours and sync signals to get an image. This site has some nice simple examples: http://www.fpga4fun.com/ (http://www.fpga4fun.com/). I'd recommend Verilog over VHDL, as its a friendlier language in terms of syntax if you are coming from a programming background.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2013.October.29. 10:10:11
In the cartridge version instead MREQ/RFSH, exist a CART signal which is valid when the cartridge memory area accessed, and only 16 address lines.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2013.October.29. 10:14:17
Quote from: Zozosoft
In the cartridge version instead MREQ/RFSH, exist a CART signal which is valid when the cartridge memory area accessed, and only 16 address lines.
Yes, although I need a clock for the SPI interface. The choices are either an onboard oscillator, or use one of the clocks from the Enterprise (at the expansion port). Given the extra work and cost in the cartridge version (the cartridge body itself), I'm starting to think the expansion port version is looking better... and certainly cheaper.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: lgb on 2013.October.29. 10:50:08
Quote
The reason I need all the address lines is to decode the address for the on-board ROM as well. Another option would actually be to use a GAL for the address decoding of the ROM, as I do the SRAM expansion, and then use the CPLD just for SPI. This would free up a few pins for additional SPI slave selects, which may be a better idea. I'll have a think about that.

Well, a single 74XX138 or so would be enough more or less, I guess, but GAL seems to be a better solution if you need something extra too. I am not sure it's worth to put an extra IC and keep a relative low pin numbered CPLD versus having only CPLD but then you require more pins, so more complex PCB is needed and harder to solder (of course this is from my viewpoint who likes strip boards and DIP packages because of the lack of needed tools and maybe talent as well to deal with really serious SMD parts and custom PCBs, hehe). For example the always mentioned 65SPI only needs four addresses to interface and it even includes SPI clock settings etc too. But anyway, on EP, memory is not so tight to even "waste" a 16K memory page (or more). I just feel some disturbance in the force sometimes, as doing "memory mapped I/O" is OK (and there are examples even on EP for this), however it can require more CPU cycles on the Z80 side that you need to do extra paging work with B0-B3 dave registers. Anyway if you need to send/receive multiple bytes in once, it can't be so serious problem, I think.

Quote
I found the best way to learn Verilog was to buy an FPGA development board (I bought an Altera DE1) and then just start playing around with it! The DE1 has a VGA out, so it's easy to write some simple Verilog code to output some colours and sync signals to get an image. This site has some nice simple examples: http://www.fpga4fun.com/ (http://www.fpga4fun.com/). I'd recommend Verilog over VHDL, as its a friendlier language in terms of syntax if you are coming from a programming background.

Thanks. Ok, just VHDL is more popular in Europe I guess, Verilog is treated as more an "USA thing", while VHDL is more common in Europe. However I don't think it's a really hard/serious classification because based on geographical regions :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: lgb on 2013.October.29. 10:55:13
Quote from: Zozosoft
In the cartridge version instead MREQ/RFSH, exist a CART signal which is valid when the cartridge memory area accessed, and only 16 address lines.

Some off-topic: for some very simple tasks (like trying to interface an AdLib/SoundBlaster OPL2 chip) it's even OK to "overlap" the basic ROM in the cartridge, as only write access to OPL2 is OK to be able use it, and it's not interpreted by the ROM anyway, so ROM area can be re-used for write access for extra hardware. I am not sure how dirty this idea will be treated as, by others though :) In theory an OPL2 can be wired in parallel to the BASIC ROM, shadowing its two registers throughout the whole BASIC ROM, but with only write access (so WR signal is needed too for example, not just the ones available on the ROM socket).

I'm not sure if this idea is useful for other puproses as well or not ...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: lgb on 2013.October.29. 11:00:44
Quote from: Saint
Yes, although I need a clock for the SPI interface. The choices are either an onboard oscillator, or use one of the clocks from the Enterprise (at the expansion port). Given the extra work and cost in the cartridge version (the cartridge body itself), I'm starting to think the expansion port version is looking better... and certainly cheaper.

65SPI has programmable clock divisor inside. Maybe you need it, SD specification says that before the SD card identification, you should keep the clock under 400KHz and you can increase the speed only, if you have the card type, and it allows it. However: I guess not so much newer card are so restricted (but maybe the specification is treated literally that init needs low clock rate even all of the new ones allows higher clock later), and also, 400KHz SPI clock is still 50kbyte/sec, which is not so bad transfer rate for a 8 bit machine. It's also interesting to calculate what is the maximum transfer rate a 4MHz Z80 can do with IN/OUT data while read/write memory. If it's far above 50kbyte/sec, than the ability not to use only a fixed 400KHz SPI clock can be useful, but not so much otherwise ...

Cartridge does not have too much clock from the EP, I guess, so yes, it can be a basic issue to have any clock as the starting point, but a simple canned oscillator (not just a crystal) is still cheap alternative. And with cartridge the connector itself is non-issue, the PCB is just enough. For people doing EXOS 2.4 modification, they don't even need a cartridge otherwise. The only disadvantage I can see is the lack of signals you may need, like some clock, or if you need other thing as well ... ?

However power supply is also interesting, I've read somewhere that in certain cases, an SD card need even 200mA or more for some very short time. Also, hot plugging an SD card is a bit problematic, but maybe you don't want to do that anyway?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2013.October.29. 11:01:56
Quote from: Saint
I'm starting to think the expansion port version is looking better... and certainly cheaper.
But it is need a bus expansion board for use with existing expansions. Or put some connectors to your board.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: BruceTanner on 2013.October.29. 11:18:36
WIZnet (who do the module I previously posted a link to) do a tiny SPI module with TCP/IP built-in - not much bigger than a RJ45 ethernet socket!:

http://www.shopwiznet.com/wiz820io (http://www.shopwiznet.com/wiz820io)

$20, requires 3.3V power but has 5v-compatible I/O.


I've found some z80 code from a MSX ethernet project that uses a similar (but not the same) WIZnet module:

http://www.konamiman.com/msx/denyonet/source/denyotcp.asm (http://www.konamiman.com/msx/denyonet/source/denyotcp.asm)

so even with a WIZnet chip that does the tcp/ip there is a fair amount of supporting code. And that just gets you TCP/IP - you still need a protocol to run on top of that, so there would be a few K more.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: lgb on 2013.October.29. 11:34:38
Quote from: BruceTanner
WIZnet (who do the module I previously posted a link to) do a tiny SPI module with TCP/IP built-in - not much bigger than a RJ45 ethernet socket!:

http://www.shopwiznet.com/wiz820io (http://www.shopwiznet.com/wiz820io)

$20, requires 3.3V power but has 5v-compatible I/O.

Funny :) If some need only/mainly ethernet and not so much SD, I would avoid SPI, as this vendor has module with parallel bus as well, which needs almost only some wires and works without any extra interfacing as far as I can see, that is: WIZ830MJ (however that was your idea on the forum originally I think). But the advantage is huge (the cost is: the embedded MCU in these stuffs are more powerful than the Z80 itself, it always bothers me somehow), you don't need UDP/TCP/IP/ARP/whatever for the Z80 to be coded! Now it's almost the "with SPI or without SPI" question, a generic SPI interface is great, etc, but sometimes I feel if you have a parallel already done solution (WIZ830) it's much easier to work with.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: BruceTanner on 2013.October.29. 12:46:05
lgb I share your reservations about using current technology to add something that is more powerful than the Enterprise itself, it seems wrong somehow, and if taken to it's logical conclusion you would end up replacing the motherboard and running a superfast emulator! But practically, if you want ethernet on the Enterprise you have two choices: a powerful add-on or write a tcp/ip stack. I don't fancy the second choice! (I'm sure the source code for a tcp/ip stack is freely available but they are nearly aways written in C etc so there is a code size/speed issue). Think of it the same as graphics cards for PCs which often used to be more powerful than the PC itself.

I also agree the WIZ830MJ would be a better choice if we were not talking about an SD card interface too - the interface is a good match for the z80. I was hoping to make this my winter project before saint raised the possibilities of an SD card interface. Maybe it is time to forget the ethernet interface for now and concentrate on just the SD card. It would be nice if they could both be used at the same time though.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2013.October.29. 14:18:53
Quote from: lgb
Some off-topic: for some very simple tasks (like trying to interface an AdLib/SoundBlaster OPL2 chip) it's even OK to "overlap" the basic ROM in the cartridge, as only write access to OPL2 is OK to be able use it, and it's not interpreted by the ROM anyway, so ROM area can be re-used for write access for extra hardware.

That's a nice idea that I'd not considered, however we require read and write access in this case, so I cant use it here. One to remember though.

Quote from: lgb
65SPI has programmable clock divisor inside. Maybe you need it, SD specification says that before the SD card identification, you should keep the clock under 400KHz and you can increase the speed only, if you have the card type, and it allows it.

Yes, the SPI Master interface has configurable phase, polarity and clock divisor from /1 through to /256. As you say SPI must be configured with a 400KHz or less SPI clock.

Quote from: Zozosoft
But it is need a bus expansion board for use with existing expansions. Or put some connectors to your board.

Eurgh, yes, this is true. I keep changing my mind about the best way to handle this expansion. Additional expansions are not really an issue for the majority of Enterprise owners here in the UK, but for those with the Spectrum emulator for example, then I'm sure it would be good to be able to use the SD card with that. Or even copying files from floppy to SD on the Enterprise itself.

I'll give the cartridge some more thought. It should just require an additional oscillator on the board, rather than using one of the Enterprise clocks. This could be clocked at a higher rate as well, like 20Mhz. Although I doubt the SPI throughput will be a bottleneck here.

Quote from: BruceTanner
WIZnet (who do the module I previously posted a link to) do a tiny SPI module with TCP/IP built-in - not much bigger than a RJ45 ethernet socket!

I've found some z80 code from a MSX ethernet project that uses a similar (but not the same) WIZnet module.

The ENC28J60 is less than £3, and there is already Z80 based source code for the SpeccyBoot project which can boot over ethernet using this chip. The only difference is that the SPI interface is "bit banged" rather than using a nice hardware SPI master interface. It depends on what you want to use the ethernet for, but in this example it loads files from a TFTP server. It's not a network share, but using FTP as a remote drive for the Enterprise may well do just fine!

My intention is to concentrate on the SD card side of it, but make sure there is expansion capability for other SPI devices such as ethernet or USB. May as well make this thing reasonably universal if it's possible to do so.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: lgb on 2013.October.29. 14:36:19
Quote from: BruceTanner
lgb I share your reservations about using current technology to add something that is more powerful than the Enterprise itself, it seems wrong somehow, and if taken to it's logical conclusion you would end up replacing the motherboard and running a superfast emulator! But practically, if you want ethernet on the Enterprise you have two choices: a powerful add-on or write a tcp/ip stack. I don't fancy the second choice! (I'm sure the source code for a tcp/ip stack is freely available but they are nearly aways written in C etc so there is a code size/speed issue). Think of it the same as graphics cards for PCs which often used to be more powerful than the PC itself.

Well, don't misunderstand me, it's some kind of the "eternal question" for me, that how "fair" to expand a 8 bit home computer with a hardware much more powerful than the computer itself, while at the same time: how cool that nowdays we _can_ do this and integrate these computers into an environment was never even planned by its designers originally. I've already written some kind IP/UDP/ARP for 6502, but not so much TCP. It won't be extra hard, but certainly it will be limited (IP fragmentation issues, MTU, etc), slower, and memory hungry that you definitely need memory expansion. Andyes, good example that was exactly the example I thought about before read your sentence about graphics card :) So sometimes I "fight" for
use the simplest solution as possible, but I want to integrate the whole universe at the next second. Annoying style of me, I must admit ...

Quote
I also agree the WIZ830MJ would be a better choice if we were not talking about an SD card interface too - the interface is a good match for the z80. I was hoping to make this my winter project before saint raised the possibilities of an SD card interface. Maybe it is time to forget the ethernet interface for now and concentrate on just the SD card. It would be nice if they could both be used at the same time though.

Hehe, I am on the opposite path it seems (more or less): if I have ethernet, I would not need SD card at all, since storage can be done over ethernet too, but not the opposite direction too much (well, ok, wi-fi capable tricky sd card, but still it's only storage oriented solution not a general network capable medium as ethernet is nowdays). I wanted SD card too at first, I've even built some extra simple bit-banging solution on the parallel port of a PC to use an SD card, which is easy to implement for EP too (even for bit-banging without hardware SPI - so you need every bit level ops/shifting "by hand" - you can get something like 4-5kbyte/sec on Z80 at 4MHz - if I remember correctly). I don't want to say now that let's skip all the hardware based SPI interfacing (big banging is a bit too slow), just that the first prototype to try to use an SD card can be like this (for the joy to try to develop myself, not to rebuild other projects). And then my "eternal question" style always drives me towards another direction, so basically I won't reach any of my goals it seems :(

By the way, it's time to open an SPI topic (and Ethernet, but maybe there is one already), since the "SD card interface" is partly about Ethernet for now, and partly SPI besides the name "SD card" :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2013.October.29. 14:48:56
I've looked at the cart interface again and could offer memory mapped I/O of the SPI hardware (4 registers) mapped into a 256 byte region. So you would have 0000-FEFF mapped to the ROM and FF00-FFFF mapped to the SPI hardware. The low 2 bits of the SPI hardware address selecting the command, status, read and write registers. No SRAM in there, I want to try and keep this simple and cheap!

This also includes 4 SPI slave select lines, one of which will be the SD card and possibly one for an ethernet chip. The others people can play with as they like.

If this pleases everyone I'll continue on this path! :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: lgb on 2013.October.29. 15:11:16
Quote from: Saint
Yes, the SPI Master interface has configurable phase, polarity and clock divisor from /1 through to /256. As you say SPI must be configured with a 400KHz or less SPI clock.

Yes, though I prefer name polarity/phase settings as SPI modes. I am not sure how useful they are, as most hardware supports (also or only) mode 0. Afaik SD card supports mode 0 (only/also?), and ENC28J60 supports only mode 0 (mode 0: CPOL and CPHA = 0). It's a good question would be know that how useful to support all the SPI modes (different CPOL/CPHA than zero, or let's say other than mode 0).

Quote
The ENC28J60 is less than £3

That's my problem too. Bruce's idea about the wiznet chips and modules are quite cool. The only problem: expensive and hard to get (in here Hungary at least). I've asked a Hungarian dealer about the 830 module, and it costs about 10000 Hungarian Forints (HUF) with shipping (and it can be even 8 weeks to deliver), while you can buy an ENC28J60 in shops from stock for about 1000HUF or even cheaper like 700HUF, but I can't remember too much. But it's true that these "network chips" from wiznet are quite cool with hardware implementation on TCP/IP. If availability and price is not an issue (and also forgetting my braindead theories about the "being fair" issue with the Z80 ...) the wiznet solution is faster in bandwidth, and also the time needed to finish the project.

BUT: just checked, eg the W5200 chip (with hardware TCP/IP) costs about 3-4$ only which is also the part of that module (what Bruce told about recently). So maybe the price is not because of the chip itself but the module's PCB and other parts. Maybe it's not a fair thing to compare as a bare ENC28J60 still needs components like the RJ45 connector with built-in magnetics, which can be quite expensive (I have no idea), I'd be interested about the cost of working ENC28J60 board which includes the additional needed components. At last, I haven't found a Hungarian shop which solds these kind of RJ45 connectors also called "magjacks" by some sources (or something similar name).

Quote
My intention is to concentrate on the SD card side of it, but make sure there is expansion capability for other SPI devices such as ethernet or USB. May as well make this thing reasonably universal if it's possible to do so.

USB? How? Do you know some kind of SPI-USB interface? USB is a cool medium as well, at least the storage protocol of USB would allow to use pen drives, hard drives (with USB adapter) but also many MP3 players, phones, camers which support storage protocol (beware! Not all of them supports it, some of them needs custom protocol). I only know about FT232 chip but it's a serial (not SPI serial, but the commonly known serial) to USB. And I am not sure it can operate in host mode too ...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2013.October.29. 15:18:38
Quote from: Saint
No SRAM in there
But SRAM needed! :twisted: RAM area can be allocated from the system segment, but using many of them make compatibility problems with some programs.
I think additional one 74xx IC enought for decode the ROM CE to ROM&SRAM CE.
Using narrow SRAM (old cache RAM from 486 boards, I have a very lot of :-) ) can be putted between ROM pins, near to all pins are common, easy to design the PCB.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2013.October.29. 16:39:41
Quote from: Zozosoft
But SRAM needed! :twisted: RAM area can be allocated from the system segment, but using many of them make compatibility problems with some programs.
I think additional one 74xx IC enought for decode the ROM CE to ROM&SRAM CE.
Using narrow SRAM (old cache RAM from 486 boards, I have a very lot of :-) ) can be putted between ROM pins, near to all pins are common, easy to design the PCB.
Lol, ok. :lol:

I can't get small SRAM easily -- I can get 32KB the cheapest, so I could add a 32KB SRAM in there and just use 4KB of it, or however much would be required. You could have a whole page if you wanted.

Board space may be getting very tight already for a cart, I'll have to have a look at layout tonight.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2013.October.29. 16:42:00
Quote from: lgb
USB? How? Do you know some kind of SPI-USB interface? USB is a cool medium as well, at least the storage protocol of USB would allow to use pen drives, hard drives (with USB adapter) but also many MP3 players, phones, camers which support storage protocol (beware! Not all of them supports it, some of them needs custom protocol). I only know about FT232 chip but it's a serial (not SPI serial, but the commonly known serial) to USB. And I am not sure it can operate in host mode too ...
Yes there are SPI USB controllers, such as this (http://www.microchip.com/wwwproducts/Devices.aspx?dDocName=en556614).
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: lgb on 2013.October.29. 17:02:29
Quote from: Saint
Yes there are SPI USB controllers, such as this (http://www.microchip.com/wwwproducts/Devices.aspx?dDocName=en556614).

Wow, cool. However as far as I can see from the datasheet, it's "only" a HID device. So you can connect it to a PC. It's still quite useful for data transfer between PC and the EP, but it cannot act as an USB host to accept devices. Or am I wrong here? I'd love to see a simple solution to be act as an USB host (or at least OTG, which can act as a host for some devices at least). But I am far from being an USB guru (even more less than SPI hehe) ...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2013.October.29. 18:31:35
Quote from: Zozosoft
But SRAM needed! :twisted: RAM area can be allocated from the system segment, but using many of them make compatibility problems with some programs.
One thought -- why would this SD card driver cause any more compatibility problems than the WD177x EXDOS disk driver? Surely you don't need any more memory to read from an SD card than a disk -- you read 512 byte sectors from one just as you would another?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: lgb on 2013.October.29. 19:44:04
Quote from: Saint
One thought -- why would this SD card driver cause any more compatibility problems than the WD177x EXDOS disk driver? Surely you don't need any more memory to read from an SD card than a disk -- you read 512 byte sectors from one just as you would another?

I am curious too, I haven't thought on this yet. Maybe if you want many drive letters like from F: - T: you need more memory than only for a single disk? Afaik this was an issue also with the IDE interface, maybe for the same reason ...

But by the way memory: if an SD-card solution would be combined with an internal memory expansion board nobody would ever say that you haven't got enough RAM already on the system, no need to add any SRAM too much just for the SD-card interface :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2013.October.29. 20:21:27
Yes it is also problem with the IDE interface.
160 bytes needed for each logical drive, for the EXDOS and device driver administration area. (Bigest part of these the storage space for the actual PATH of the drive.)
If you want all possible drives from F to Z then 21*160=3360 bytes plus some for the expansion ROM variables.
This is not a problem for the EXOS or BASIC, but some programs don't allocate memory from the EXOS, just directly overwrite it. These are calculating with the normal EXDOS memory usage (only A-E drives), with the IDE (and will the SD) more system segment used are are overwritten :evil:
Possible allocate memory in a separate segment, but two other problems:
- this function have a bug in EXOS 2.0/2.1 and can not be used :-( Only work with my bugfixed/updated EXOS version. Then needed to upgrade the onboard ROM
- many-many improper programs which are not allocate memory from the EXOS, directly overwrite F8-FF segments, then the separate segment for the IDE/SD ROM only safe bellow F8, then memory expansion needed.

Currently the IDE ROM allocate own segment if EXOS version are higher than 2.1 and memory expansion exist.

If the SD interface have a hidden RAM area in the ROM segment then all problem will be solved!

The hardcore users have (or can install) a upgraded EXOS and memory expansions, but many users want a easy way for using unmodified machine with modern fast storage, just want a play games as "plug and play" :-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: lgb on 2013.October.29. 21:09:46
Quote from: Zozosoft
Yes it is also problem with the IDE interface.
160 bytes needed for each logical drive, for the EXDOS and device driver administration area. (Bigest part of these the storage space for the actual PATH of the drive.)
If you want all possible drives from F to Z then 21*160=3360 bytes plus some for the expansion ROM variables.

Ok, but using so much drives - as I guess - is only needed because of the size limitation of FAT12 (I would always prefer to use less drives, or even zero, as UNIX does not need this notion - drive letters are from CP/M originally even in DOS/Windows ...). If some hasn't got EXDOS at all and wants SD card, drives before F: can be used as well for SD card, right? And also the "try to modify EXDOS to use FAT16" would be a great idea :) I guess if someone does not have a true EXDOS card with floppy drive, FAT16 is always superior, and there can't be too much compatibility issues that they need FAT12 support at all ... And since they haven't got EXDOS card, no EXDOS ROM either, that must be supplied, maybe in a bit modificated form.

I am not sure how frequent some "average" user wants and SD card interface for the EP using also a "real" EXDOS and using tons of drive letters at the same time.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2013.October.29. 21:52:20
Quote from: lgb
(I would always prefer to use less drives, or even zero, as UNIX does not need this notion - drive letters are from CP/M originally even in DOS/Windows ...).
I like the letters, because the EXDOS have a drive letters :-D

Quote
drives before F: can be used as well for SD card, right?
If you delete the floppy drives then the RAMDISK go down to A: then will be problem because the programs search the RAMDISK at E:

Quote
And also the "try to modify EXDOS to use FAT16" would be a great idea :)
Adding FAT16 probably not a to hard work (but need a time...), but only solve the to big clusters problem. Maximum disk size still 65535 sectors.
The BIGDOS FAT16 can solve the partiton size problem, but this is will be very hard work, because the original sector operations use 16 bit registers for sector number, need to free up more registers and add new function calls for handle more than 65535 sectors.

Quote
I am not sure how frequent some "average" user wants and SD card interface for the EP using also a "real" EXDOS and using tons of drive letters at the same time.
Average users use a disk browser sw for select game :-) I will be modify (or write) one for display Volume Labels with the drive letters, then the drives looks as directory, for example DEMOS, GAMES_A-B, UTIL, etc
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2013.October.29. 21:55:11
Ok, I understand the problem now, I'll see what I can do! I agree this really wants to be a proper "plug and play" device so anyone with an Enterprise can use and SD card without having to open up the machine and install new ROM's or more memory.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2013.October.29. 22:01:35
Quote from: Saint
I can't get small SRAM easily --
Somewhere I have a lot of (least 40-50) W24257/W24512 (or compatible) SRAMs which are saved from 486 boards at about 15 years ago :-)
I used one for replace onboard memory :-)
[attach=1]
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: lgb on 2013.October.30. 12:20:06
It seems there is ENC28J60 emulation in FUSE spectrum emulator at least if you run it on Linux. So in theory, it would be possible to port the code into ep128emu or so, thus it'd be possible to develop software on the emulator for some kind of ENC28J60 based solution.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.February.10. 02:57:23
I`ve seen this:

http://www.toshiba-components.com/FlashAir/

It can be an easy(yet sligthy expensive) way to have a semi-host conection by WIFI with a PC.

http://www.amazon.com/Toshiba-PFW008U-1ABW-FlashAir-Wireless-Class/dp/B00BXAXH74/ref=sr_1_11?ie=UTF8&qid=1391997190&sr=8-11&keywords=flashair
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.February.19. 09:31:04
Quote
Fantastic! I look forward to seeing the new super-fast Enterprise computers which come out of this. May even over-clock one myself... (http://enterpriseforever.com/Smileys/phpbb/ds_icon_mrgreen.gif)

Formerly you mentioned the planning of a new storage device for the EP, with an SD card solution.
Now, we have already an SD card solution, where we have an IDE controller card created by Zozo, and we use IDE to SD converters cheaply available on the net.
The only problem is with this solution (for me) the relatively big size. It is designed as a normal expansion card, like the exdos, or anything. And we connect HDDs or IDE to SD converters to it. So the SD card is much smaller, much quiet and slightly faster than the HDDs, but the size of the IDE card remain.

Do you still plan a small, probably inside assembled SD card solution, or it turned out a hard task ?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.February.19. 10:00:46
Yes, I am still planning to do this. Funnily enough, I've just been thinking about prototyping it. I've got some edge connectors and vero board ready, and will be ordering some PLCC sockets and MAX3000A chips as well as some FLASH and SRAM so I can wire-wrap a test board.

I'm going to use the expansion port first, just because I can create a prototype without getting a PCB made for the edge connector, then when this is working I will think about the possibility of a cartridge version as well.

I've got it all drawn out on a piece of paper, using a GAL (I have quite a few spare now! :)) for the address decoding for FLASH, SRAM and the MAX3000A SPI chip (being memory mapped). This means I can move the design over more easily to the cartridge port if needed.

I was also thinking I may add 512KB RAM and 512KB FLASH to the board and possibly other things like a real time clock. The RAM and ROM would make this a nice external expansion for people who have an unexpanded EP64.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.February.19. 10:27:32
Quote
I was also thinking I may add 512KB RAM and 512KB FLASH to the board and possibly other things like a real time clock. The RAM and ROM would make this a nice external expansion for people who have an unexpanded EP64.
Yes, I think the ROM is very important, because the EXDOS software have to be somewhere in the machine, and if your expansion will be in the cartridge instead of inside the machine body, then there will not be place for EXDOS.

Or maybe EXDOS can be placed to the mainboard to a modified system rom ... But in this case, the main machine have to be disassembled.

If we could make pretty small housing, the expansion version could be as good as the cartridge solution. But this housing could be hard task to do.
And that is a cool thing too, somebody can use the expansion for other cards, and your base HW could be in cartridge.

And yes, the ultimate best solution would be, when I get an original, unmodified EP, and place a cartridge to the left side, and I have everything ... :)

But, how I understand, the inside ram expansion is compatible with 10MHz machine too, so probably the best place for ram expansion is the inside place. So maybe the RAM has not neccessary to be in the cartridge. Or maybe in that situation, when I can use your "everythinginacartridge" expansion on an original, unmodified EP, with XXX+128K memory,
and with the 10MHz hack, we drop out the inside 64K expansion, and use your cartridge with an XXX+64K memory configuration at 10MHz.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.February.19. 10:37:04
Or maybe, I'm wrong at EXDOS, and your storage device will not be an EXDOS "extension" ?
I think the current IDE card work somehow like an EXDOS "extension", and this will be good for any storage device,
but in the emulator, there is a FILE device, what is not such like the IDE, but a different device for EXOS ... or what ...

Zozo, can It be good in practice, when a storage hw is not EXDOS "compatible" like the IDE card ?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.February.19. 10:57:33
Quote
Or maybe in that situation, when I can use your "everythinginacartridge" expansion on an original, unmodified EP, with XXX+128K memory,
and with the 10MHz hack, we drop out the inside 64K expansion, and use your cartridge with an XXX+64K memory configuration at 10MHz.
Or, the cartridge would be compatible with every single configuration ... with an original unmodified configuration (XXX+128K memory),
or a 10MHz hack, and dropped inner 64K configuration (XXX+64K memory),
or an XXMHz and inside already (for example 1MB) expanded configuration (XXX+1MB+64K memory) ... :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.February.19. 18:49:12
To be honest I was thinking more bare-bones style! Like these Speccy interfaces (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/DIVIDE-2k11-Compact-Flash-4gb-Sandisk-Ultra-/181324802977?pt=UK_VintageComputing_RL&hash=item2a37cceba1).

ROM and RAM would be positioned in memory such that they were not conflicting with the existing 512KB or 1MB internal expansion. I think it would need just EXDOS and Zozo's SD card driver (like the IDE CF driver).

One page of the RAM (well, 4KB of it) would be shared with one page of the ROM to enable the driver to only require a single page to operate. I believe this was the request, Zozo?

I believe there is a fast memory test we can include in this expansion as well? So people with unmodified EP's dont have to wait forever for the memory to test... :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.February.20. 00:07:56
Yes, Saint, on the expansion bay you have all the posibilities, not at the cartridge bay. But could be nice to find a good use for that little boxes that gave to the EP that look of expandability....

Thinking about RAMs and ROMs, the definitive design could be to have an image of the EP memory and drives, on a SD card, and fool the machine to think they are the real things.....like we do in the emulator.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.February.20. 12:54:21
Quote
To be honest I was thinking more bare-bones style! Like these Speccy interfaces (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/DIVIDE-2k11-Compact-Flash-4gb-Sandisk-Ultra-/181324802977?pt=UK_VintageComputing_RL&hash=item2a37cceba1).
Okay, I read again in the hungarian topic, and I see that the IDE controller is an EXDOS extension.

So how I see, there is the EXDOS, which is the already done, de facto EP disk standard, and it has an EXOS device interface towards the EXOS ( DISK: ), and has a FAT12 implementation, and an other extendable device interface inside itself, handling different hardware devices.

This DISK: device can be the default device to EXOS, and file access will be done through EXDOS in this situation. (Without explicit device specification, like "TAPE:dummy.com"

So when a storage device is such an EXDOS extension, then it will capable of everything what EXDOS can do. It is good, because we have FAT12 filesystem, and every function what is implemented in EXDOS on the new device, immediately. It has drawbacks too, like FAT12 has many limitations, such the little partition size, and so on.


The second choice would be a different EXOS device, like TAPE: or DISK:, in this case we are not bound anymore to EXDOS, FAT12 or anything, but we have nothing from the already implemented features, too. So your SD device would be named SAINT:, and you will have to write every function from scratch, which handle files or filesystems on it, and offers the files to EXOS on a file access. In this case the default device could be SAINT:, and file access would go through the SAINT: device.


So it is, what I think I know. I do not understand what more bare-bones style that speccy interface works, and how could that style work with EP and/or EXOS.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.February.20. 13:03:46
Quote
Yes, Saint, on the expansion bay you have all the posibilities, not at the cartridge bay. But could be nice to find a good use for that little boxes that gave to the EP that look of expandability....
Yes, It would be the mega ultimate goodness, but maybe the cartridge port itself is designed for ROM(RAM) type of extensions, and unfortunately not for any extension we can imagine ... :(

And that is only an unfortunate fact we never used the cartridge bay with many different cartridges because the lack of those ... :(
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.March.12. 00:18:49
I've built up the first part of my prototype. It's just an address decoding GAL and a FLASH chip hooked up to expansion port, which should give me a 256KB ROM board.

However whenever I boot up, I just get a crash. Almost exactly like I had with the EXDOS board with the slow EPROM giving me a green screen or other odd crashes.

How does EXOS work with extension ROMs? Does it look for EXOS_ROM as the first 8 bytes, and if they exist, jump to that ROM on bootup? I'm wondering whether its crashing trying to execute the ROM (I put EPPLUS on there), or if the bus is just getting corrupted through some timing issue.

Also, is it possible to page in a ROM and read its contents easily from BASIC? It would be handy if I could program the ROM with just some text, and try and read it on the EP to see if I've made any wiring mistakes. :roll:
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.March.12. 09:14:10
Quote from: Saint
How does EXOS work with extension ROMs? Does it look for EXOS_ROM as the first 8 bytes, and if they exist, jump to that ROM on bootup?
Shortly: yes.
Longer: EXOS System Extension Interface (http://gafz.enterpriseforever.com/Dokumentacio/Konyvek/EXOS_2.1_technikal_information/exos/kernel/Ch9.html)

Quote
Also, is it possible to page in a ROM and read its contents easily from BASIC? It would be handy if I could program the ROM with just some text, and try and read it on the EP to see if I've made any wiring mistakes. :roll:
10 S=4
20 FOR I=0 TO 7
30 PRINT CHR$(SPEEK(S,I));
40 NEXT
50 PRINT

S=segment number, I=address
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.March.12. 10:15:41
Perfect, thankyou Zozo!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.March.12. 14:55:23
Is there a limit to which ROM slots you can use? The emulator seems to have a limited set...

0-7, 10-13, 20-23, 30-33, 40-43

And are these hex values? I assume they are.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.March.12. 15:34:43
I tested the 16KB page with a psudorandom non-repeating pattern, it all verifies ok from basic. All other segments on the flash read 255 as expected. Very weird it wont boot from it... :mad:
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.March.12. 15:53:32
00-03h are the onboard ROM
04-07h Cartridge socket
F8-FBh 64k expansion in EP128
FC-FFh onboard RAM (Video)
All others can be used for any ROM or RAM expansion.
EXOS 2.0/2.1 just detect ROM programs at 04-07h,x0h segments.
My updated versions (2.2+) can detect at any segment.

EXDOS are on the 20-21h segments, address decoded 20-2Fh to the ROM socket on the EXDOS card.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.March.12. 20:22:10
Ok, I'm using page 0x40 at the moment, so this should boot on any EXOS version.

So, it looks like the issue is with the M1 read cycle. I had just been using address decode & MREQ for the CE, as OE and CE need to be low for the data lines to be driven, so I shouldn't need to worry about RFSH. But to be sure, I added the RFSH line and changed CE to be address decode & MREQ & !RFSH. This made no odds... :(

So I had a look at the CE and OE lines with the scope. They look fine, both CE and OE assert and de-assert at the same time and I can see pulses of about 300ns (the M1 cycle) and 500ns (normal read). They look fine... 

The only slightly odd thing is if I look at CE and D0. I can see CE assert, then shortly afterwards D0 is asserted either high or low. When driven low, after CE is deasserted the D0 line tristates and floats up to about 2v. This is what seems to happen for normal bus access on the EP.

Now when the flash drives the bus high, it drives to 5v (other signals on the EP are 4v), and it seems to remain it 5v even after the bus is tristated when CE is deasserted. So that's a little strange. This is the only thing so far that seems odd, though...

Has anyone tried a 29C020 (or other 29Cxxx) with the EP? I just happened to have one lying around, hence the prototype was built with it...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.March.12. 20:42:40
Quote from: Saint
Has anyone tried a 29C020 (or other 29Cxxx) with the EP?
Yes, and no problem.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Tuby128 on 2014.March.12. 22:03:45
I didn't read all your comments but the last several. Are you using a pull-up resistor on your extension card? Sometimes pull-up resisors can help to close the end of a bus. With this solution the floating bits can be forgotten. Of course it's just an assumption.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.March.12. 22:27:19
Quote from: Tuby128
I didn't read all your comments but the last several. Are you using a pull-up resistor on your extension card? Sometimes pull-up resisors can help to close the end of a bus. With this solution the floating bits can be forgotten. Of course it's just an assumption.
Yeah, pulldown resistors was a thought I had on the data lines, but they shouldn't really be needed. While the bus is floating the logic level doesn't actually matter, and as soon as something else drives the bus then the logic level changes. It does seem a little odd that the high impedance state of the 29Cxxx keeps the logic level high like that, though.

I'm still wondering if its timing related. The m1 cycle has less time for the data lines to be asserted and latched than normal read / write cycles. But it's still 3 T states, so about 375ns. With a 90ns FLASH, that still leaves a lot of time spare...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.March.12. 23:18:00
This is really weird. All the timings look fine. There is about a 40ns delay from the falling edge of T1 to the FLASH CE, then about another 50ns delay from there to the data being valid. So only about 90ns from the falling edge of T1 and the data is valid. And it stays valid until the end of T2 + 40ns. The CE is low for the full 375ns, just delayed. So it all looks spot on... :ds_icon_frown:

The address lines also don't change until the rising edge of CE, which is after the data should have been latched.

I'll try and hook up the logic analyser tomorrow and see if I can see what's on the data lines when CE is low...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2014.March.15. 21:55:52
Here's a short report. The ENTERPRISE 128 SD card interface (http://szergitata.blog.hu/2014/03/15/enterprise_128_sd_adapter_cartridge_protra_sd_interface_on_cartridge_port) first prototype has been operating state on this week.
I'm trying to put on a better video :-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.March.16. 22:15:56
As I understand, Wifi SD cards work(apart as a storage) as an access point in which, once connected, you can read or write the files inside the card. Thus, is not the EP which operates the Wifi side, it works by itself. Even some wifi SD-cards act as a repeater of another wireless point, and then the PC, phone or tablet not lose access to the Internet.


It acts like a wireless host connection, you don't have to constantly extract the SD card and put it on a card-reader near a PC, you manage the SD files confortably on a drawer inside the PC(or phone or tablet).

-----------------
Según yo lo veo, Las tarjetas Wifi-SD funcionan(a parte de como almacenamiento) como un punto de acceso, en el cual, una vez conectado, puedes leer o escribir los fichero que hay dentro. Por lo tanto, No es el EP el que opera la parte Wifi, funciona por si misma. Incluso algunas funcionan como repetidores de otros puntos de acceso inalambricos, para que el PC, smartphone o tablet no pierdan su conexión a Internet.

Actúa como una conexión host inalámbrica, no tienes que constantemente sacar la tarjeta SD e introducirla en un lector de tarjetas cerca del PC, tú manejas los ficheros de la SD confortablemente dentro de una carpeta en el PC( o smartphone o tablet)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.March.16. 22:24:14
Quote
As I understand, Wifi SD cards work as an access point in which, once connected, you can read or write the files inside the card. Thus, is not the EP which operates the Wifi side, it works by itself.
Yes, I'm agreed,

but I am afraid of the wifi can understand only more modern filesystems on the SD card, like FAT32, exFAT, NTFS or maybe FAT16 ... but EP SD card solutions (Zozosoft's one or this new constructing one) handle only FAT12 filesystem.

So when we will format a wifi SD card to this FAT12, then probably the wifi part can not read/write the EP partitions anymore because of the filesystem...

I'm not sure, but probably it will be the situation ...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.March.16. 22:24:25
Very nice job! Dd you end up using a CPLD to handle the SPI interface?

I'll get back to trying to track down why my flash isn't reading from the z80 again next week... :)

I'll still develop mine as I still like the idea of an 'all in one' expansion which would allow a standard ep64 to run all software. So RAM upgrade plus flash and SD interface.

Great to see more new hardware for the old Enterprise. :D
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.March.16. 22:35:38
Quote
I'll still develop mine as I still like the idea of an 'all in one' expansion which would allow a standard ep64 to run all software. So RAM upgrade plus flash and SD interface.
And finally which direction did you choose for the connection ? Will it be an inside expansion, like the RAM expansion, or a right side expansion port device ? (Zozo said the cartridge placement direction is dropped.)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.March.16. 22:37:25
Ah, now I understand you. You are right, but in the comments of the article Zozo is "threatening" with a Fat16 operating system surely compatible with it... Plain SDs before the actual SDHC or SDXC can access up to 2Gig(or 4Gig with tricks), enough for the EP.
----------------------
Ah, ya entiendo. Tienes razón, pero creo que Zozo ya ha "amenazado" con un sistema de ficheros FAT16 que ya si que sería compatible.... Las tarjetas normales SD(antes de las actuales SDHC o SDXC) pueden manejar hasta 2Gig(o 4Gig con trucos), suficiente para el EP.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.March.17. 10:29:16
Quote from: Z80System
And finally which direction did you choose for the connection ? Will it be an inside expansion, like the RAM expansion, or a right side expansion port device ? (Zozo said the cartridge placement direction is dropped.)
I plan to do both an internal expansion and a plug in expansion port card. I like the idea of a single card which will allow any Enterprise (128 or 64) to run any software designed for 128K RAM or more. So this means it has to be either internal or on the expansion port to give the additional RAM at F8-FB. The internal card is more for me than anyone else, as prefer to be able to run the machine with no expansions plugged in... it just looks neater. :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.March.17. 10:45:56
Quote
The internal card is more for me than anyone else, as prefer to be able to run the machine with no expansions plugged in... it just looks neater. (http://enterpriseforever.com/Smileys/phpbb/smiley.gif)
No, you are wrong, when they will be available (at a price I can pay) I would like both of them too, because of the reasons you mentioned.

One of them is good for EPs what you don't want to assemble, and one of them is good for final assemble, for a nicer EP.

Cartridge version would be the megaultimate version, beacause that would provide both of the goodness. But Zozo said yesterday, the cartridge unfortunately can have only four segments of memory ...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.March.17. 11:20:30
Quote from: Saint
using a CPLD to handle the SPI interface?
He wrote in the Hungarian forum: it is a Xilinx CPLD.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.March.18. 21:16:12
I wired up the 29c020 to the internal memory expansion and reprogrammed the GAL for 64KB at 40-43, and it boots fine. There must be some crosstalk I guess on the "big mess of wires" that is my prototype causing some random noise.

Ah, well, I'll just get on and create a proper PCB instead then!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.March.18. 21:49:52
Zozo -- would it be easier if I created the internal expansion first? Once I have one built and some code written to access the SD card, I will send you one to write the EXDOS driver.

If I build the internal expansion first then you can still use EXDOS or any other storage device on the expansion port to help test and code.

Let me know what you think...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.March.18. 21:58:02
Quote
If I build the internal expansion first then you can still use EXDOS or any other storage device on the expansion port to help test and code.
Zozo probably has expansion port splitter cards, with what you can connect multiple expansion port carts to the EP ...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.March.18. 22:02:45
Some people in Hungary (like Zozo) have configs similar like these:

http://ep128.hu/Album/Pic/Ep&HDD.jpg
http://ep128.hu/Album/Pic/Ep_Klub_21.jpg
http://ep128.hu/Album/Pic/Ep_Klub_19.jpg
http://ep128.hu/Album/Pic/Ep_Klub_16.jpg
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.March.18. 22:05:02
Internal or external also OK for me :-D
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.March.20. 05:05:04
This is some out of topic here, but I have received a WIFI SD card I ordered. The brand is Transcend, the 16G model.

As it is greater than 4Gig it is formated to FAT32, but I`ve managed to partition it to four 4Gig partitions formated to FAT16. Then I had mixed results, as only the first division is recognised, but the WIFI side reads perfectly the content of the card, that can be acessed remotely. I have inserted it on a camera and the SD card sends pictures to my android phone via the App suited.

The system is intended for digital cameras and so it is a bit limited, but it allows transfering any type of files than only Jpeg or Mov.

Next tests are: first to do a little FAT12 partition, and second to connect it properly to Windows, not only by web page.


Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.March.20. 08:54:49
So then the Wifi SD not a Wifi for the host, just a dual access (local/network) storage?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.March.20. 16:33:39
It appears like this  small little card has inside an ARM processor at 400Mh running a Linux environment, but has been castrated to only permit  to do a few things with few file types, and only in one way. There are people actually working on hacking it. Some claim have already got root, but this scene is only in its beginnings.


On this (http://www.randomprojects.org/wiki/SD_wifi_cards#Transcend_Wi-Fi_SD_card) page you have more information.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.March.20. 17:23:06
Quote from: Zozosoft
So then the Wifi SD not a Wifi for the host, just a dual access (local/network) storage?
Only permits transfer files from the camera SD-card to the up to three devices connected, only that way (I was wrong), but it can be inserted on a card reader on a device and allows to add files to the card.

Just the stock card has little use for the future SD card interface(we need traffic in both ways), but the panorama can change as the card is poorly protected...

The only proved fact is that the system works FAT16 formatted, but you lose part of the storage (is better to buy the same but 8Gig wifi card, as you only lose half).

I bought this card for use in the HXD, which has no problems with FAT32, but better meanwhile I'll use it on a camera...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.March.20. 19:31:37
I thought it was a like a hard drive WIFI brand Conceptronics that I own. Has similar features, but is fully accessible from any device connected.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.March.20. 19:53:57
Quote from: gflorez
Only permits transfer files from the camera SD-card
Just read, no write?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.March.21. 00:33:34
Exact, only can be writed when inserted on a card reader. Disapointing....for now.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SlashNet on 2014.March.21. 01:22:51
Temporarily I have similar (http://www.eye.fi/) card.
It transfers files by Wi-Fi only from device to PC (photos & videos).
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.March.22. 23:28:05
Now I have found(by myself...) a simple way to transfer files to the root of WIFISD.

It appears that uploading was an option that was dropped before being marketed, then a web page named "uploadto.html" was left without links from the principal web page.

Thanks to the poor security of the card you can access the folder where that HTMLs stay and run it...



This is not like a decent shell as I wanted, but is a minimum of commodity...


On the other hand, some hacker as discovered that Transcend had left open another door. At boot the card looks for a script in case of an upgrade, and it lets me to run a telnet connection thanks to a clever lines written by some guy..... just with only the script and an open version of a command named Busybox at the root of the card.


But for now I have to study to benefit me from this via, as I am an ignorant on Linux... and nearly on all....
-------------------------------------
Acabo de encontrar(por mi mismo...) una forma de transferir ficheros a la raíz de la WIFISD.


Parece que la opción de enviar ficheros fue abandonada antes de la comercialización, entonces, una pagina web llamada "uploadto.html" fue dejada sin enlace desde la pagina web principal.

Gracias a la pobre seguridad de la tarjeta, puedes acceder a la carpeta donde están alojados esos HTMLs y ejecutarlo...


Esto no es un Shell decente como yo quería, pero es un mínimo de comodidad...


Por otro lado, algún hacker ha descubierto que Trascend ha dejado abierta otra puerta. En el arranque la tarjeta busca un fichero para el caso de que exista una actualización, y eso me permite ejecutar una conexión telnet gracias a unas cuantas lineas inteligentes escritas por algún tipo..... solo se necesita el script y una versión abierta de un comando llamado Busybox en la raiz de la tarjeta.


Pero de momento tengo que estudiar para beneficiarme de esa vía, porque soy un ignorante en Linux... y en casi todo....
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.March.23. 00:02:49
The board layout is more or less finished now, just need to double check everything, then I'll get some boards made up. You can also see from the PCB I've included an extra SPI header, so if anyone wants to add a second SPI device, you can. There are more lines spare on the CPLD, so if people come up with good extra SPI devices, I can always create another expansion board with more devices on... :)

I'll have to get SDCC setup properly to write some some code to actually test the SPI interface.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.March.23. 01:05:30
You bring good news Saint. Sorry for usurp some this thread...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.March.23. 08:51:18
You bring good news Saint. Sorry for usurp some this thread...

Not at all, your news is very interesting! :) I was looking at SPI WIFI modules as well, but the WIFI SD cards are a great solution...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.March.23. 20:42:51
I've gained bi-directional ftp access to my WIFISD.

Busybox is a condensed library of Linux commands made for tiny environments, much like Exdos on our EP, and inside it there are plenty of utilities that can make work almost every task you can imagine. I've searched the net for information on how to mount a ftp with Busybox and, in his official page (http://www.busybox.net/downloads/BusyBox.html), the creator gives two ways, but I opted for the easiest. The only drawback is that you can access to non-SD area, that is not formatted in FAT32, and thus you can damage "some" the Linux system if you write on it.

For now I only know the Telnet direct command, some as "/sbin/busybox tcpsvd -vE 192.168.11.254 21 /sbin/busybox ftpd -w /mnt/sd", but the same doesn't work inside the autorun.sh script for now, surely caused by a wrong path.

if I get to know the exact command for the ftp-thing then it will be accessible to anyone who put the custom script in the root directory + Busybox.


The attached file is the ftp working. Observe the path at the right side. "sd" is the storage space mounted(mnt), but you have root access to the Linux system if you dare.....
------------------------

He conseguido acceso ftp bi-direccional para mi WIFISD.

Busybox es una librería condensada de comandos Linux creada para entornos minúsculos, parecido a Exdos en nuestro EP, y dentro de él hay suficientes utilidades para hacer funcionar casi cualquier tarea que te imagines. He buscado por la red información sobre como montar un ftp, y, en la página (http://www.busybox.net/downloads/BusyBox.html) oficial el creador nos da dos caminos, pero yo he optado por el mas fácil. La única pega es que se puede acceder a la zona que no es SD, que no está formateada en FAT32, y por lo tanto puedes perjudicar "algo" el sistema Linux si escribes allí.

Por ahora solo conozco el comando directo Telnet, algo como "/sbin/busybox tcpsvd -vE 192.168.11.254 21 /sbin/busybox ftpd -w /mnt/sd", pero el mismo no funciona dentro del script autorun.sh, segúramente causado por una ruta de acceso erronea.

Si consigo el comando exacto para la cosa ftp entonces será accesible para cualquiera que ponga en el directorio raiz de la tarjeta SD el script custom  + Busybox.


El fichero adjunto muestra el ftp funcionando. Observa la ruta de la parte de la derecha. "sd" es el espacio de almacenamiento montado(mnt), pero tienes acceso root al sistema Linux si te atreves....
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.March.24. 09:44:08
Quote from: Saint
The board layout is more or less finished now,
I miss the 5V power parts :oops:
It is will be stand vertical?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.March.24. 10:27:32
I miss the 5V power parts :oops:
It is will be stand vertical?

It's a split 5v and 3.3v design, both with 250ma max (U5 an U6). Should be enough for a second SPI device.

This board will stand vertically, yes. I was thinking I might extend the bottom of the pcb so it's inline with the bottom of the Enterprise to give some support. One thing I don't like about the vertical design is you can put a lot of leverage on the pcb edge if you knock the board. Although the board isn't very tall...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.March.25. 15:33:22
Zozo -- do you have any source code for an EXOS extension? I would like to try and start looking at writing code to test the SD card adapter. I would like to be able to write to a FLASH ROM and plug it into the board and be able to do something like:

:TEST

and get some results printed out on the screen, a bit like a DOS program would.

Any help on how to do this, much appreciated. I've just ordered the components I need, so once I've double checked those on the PCB layout I'll order some PCB's, then its onto the software side.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.March.25. 16:35:14
Try it :-) (Use Programmer’s Notepad (http://www.pnotepad.org/) for edit. In Windows Notepad the tabs looks crazy :oops: )
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.March.25. 18:09:38
Thank you Zozo, perfect as always... :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.March.25. 19:50:32
I've realised what was wrong with the ftp command. With "tcpsvd -vE 192.168.11.254 21  ftpd -w /mnt/sd" I was setting a FTP that can only connect with that IP(itself!). On the other side if I set it as 0.0.0.0 the card is listening for all accessing IPs...  

Now, for everybody that is anxious to test it.......only put that little script on the root of your new Transcend WIFISD as it jumps out of the box....

Not so easy, previously you must extract securely the card and reinsert it, as the changes only will be efective until next boot of the WIFISD.

Then you must connect to it by WIFI (Domain:WIFISD Password:12345678) and then access it by ftp....

You have a FTP client for Firefox here (http://fireftp.net/). Once installed and rebooted Firefox, you only have to put FTP://192.168.11.254 on the URL box, hit return and the browser changes from HTML to FTP view and connects automatically to the card without passwords.

Now you are free to interchange files, delete, rename, etc, between the card and your computer.


-----------------------------
On the other side there are people exploring if this SD card can bring Wifi capabilities to the device where it is connected, imagine downloading something immediately from the WEB to the EP...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.March.25. 20:02:24
Quote
Now you are free to interchange files, delete, rename, etc, between the card and your computer.
It's cool, but the main problem remains. It can be only FAT16 and EP can use only FAT12. And no vice versa.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.March.25. 20:20:48
But Zozo said he was actually working in a FAT16 OS for the EP... We have been waiting 30 years for some miracles that are now real on the EP(10Mhz, almost all the memory map populated, SD card reader, IDE HDs, and many more).



We can wait a little...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.March.25. 20:24:49
Quote
We can wait a little...

Is not that an option to teach the OS on the wifi card the FAT12 ?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.March.25. 20:36:04
On the other side.... I don't know how to do a FAT12 partition on that SD card. I have used "MiniTool partition" for FAT16 but it doesn't have a FAT12 option. May be the WIFISD would accept it...but enough of tiny partitions, the goal now is FAT16(=4G!).

Even the IDE card from Zozo can benefit from even greater partitions.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.March.25. 20:37:35
Quote from: Z80System
EP can use only FAT12
Currently! :-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.March.25. 20:40:17
Quote from: gflorez
I don't know how to do a FAT12 partition on that SD card.
Most easy way write out VHD files to the card.
Empty VHD files. (http://www.ep128.hu/Emu/Ep_ide_files.rar)
VHD with lot of programs. (http://www.ep128.hu/Emu/Ep_ide192m.rar)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.March.25. 20:42:54
Quote
Currently! (http://enterpriseforever.com/Smileys/phpbb/ds_icon_smile.gif)
Is not it a slightly big chunk of meat ?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.March.25. 20:43:23
Quote from: gflorez
I have used "MiniTool partition" for FAT16 but it doesn't have a FAT12 option.
All Windows partition program stupid :evil:
If I remember right can be done by FreeDOS. Firstly create partitions then with another command change the type to FAT12, and finaly format the partitions.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.March.25. 20:50:55
OK, I'll test tomorrow if the WIFISD accepts FAT12 partitions, but for me is of no use....
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.March.25. 20:53:39
Quote from: Z80System
Is not it a slightly big chunk of meat ?
On TVC VT-DOS done by Pal Sebestyen. Now needed to combine the modified routines with the EXDOS. The main difference: on VT-DOS FAT12 routines are completly replaced, and all floppy routines droped and replaced by directly with SD routines.
I want to keep the originaly capatibilities of the EXDOS, everything will be a plus.
On TVC the ROM space are limited, but on Enterprise we have a lot of space.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.March.26. 12:11:15
Definitely FAT12 doesn't work with the WIFISD Transcend. It waits indefinitely trying to connect, I don't know why. I will not do more research on this, no worth it.


But I like to see if I can make visible for the card the other 4Gig partitions, so even if Windows does not want to access them on a card reader, we could via FTP...


I will try to mount them in the autorun.sh script.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.March.27. 23:14:37
Layout tidied up, fixed a few errors and first batch of PCB's ordered.

Plus I've got SDCC compiling a ROM extension and working with the emulator. I've even made a start on the SD card setup code. So I just need some hardware to start testing now... :ds_icon_cheesygrin:

Going to be quite slow debugging having to write code and flash a chip to test on real hardware!!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.March.28. 00:12:13
Seems like someone(a tech hacker named CNLohr (https://cnlohr.net/pubsvn/electrical/SDComputer/)) has achieved communication with the WIFISD by means of the 4-bit protocol. 

He has dropped the schematics of a "motherboard" for the card and all the code to allow everybody repeat the project.

Here is a video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Z9TrZQw16s) of the thing working and the web page (http://hackaday.com/2013/10/09/a-motherboard-for-a-wifi-enabled-sd-card/) that has published the notice.

For now it's "only" I2C protocol, as other hacker(Dimitry (http://dmitry.gr/index.php?r=05.Projects&proj=15&proj=15. Transcend WiFiSD)) says in a commentary that the real protocol of the card is still unknown, but very much fast and potent.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.March.28. 12:01:17
But this new is from October 2013....
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.April.23. 23:57:04
I got my prototype PCB's through yesterday. This is the first one built up with just the SRAM and FLASH as a test. Here you can see it running with additional 512KB RAM and 512KB FLASH.

Next is to install the CPLD and start testing the SPI interface.

Edit: Zozo, how are you getting on with the SD card software for the cartridge expansion? Do you have any working code for setting up and reading the SD card with the cartridge hardware? I am using some PIC Micro source code as the base for my SD card code, but if you already have something working I could use, that would save me a lot of time. :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.April.24. 00:17:41
Isn`t it little, precious, alive, like a new born?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Bagpuss22 on 2014.April.24. 20:43:41
@Saint, looking good, as always :smt023

Russ
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.April.25. 11:10:27
Looks very amazing!
One question: the final version will be available with standard edge connection, for use with existing expansion?

About the sw: I got ready to use SD DISKIO routines, which are developed to the Videoton TVC version. I just connected these to EXDOS system.
The DISKIO have these functions:
0 - Disk System Reset (initializing)
1-8 unknow command, for avoiding problems with old programs which are use original 16 bit DiskIO system (floppy, etc)
9 - read sector with 32 bit LBA address
10 - write sectors with 32 bit LBA address
11 - write&verify sectors with 32 bit LBA address
12 - I/O controll functions:
I/O 1 - read CSD register and calculate card size in 512 bytes sectors
I/O 2 - read CID register
I/O 3 - read OCR register
I/O 4 - check disk change
I/O 5 - select active card

A register: command code (0, 9-12)
For sector operations (9-11):
BC: high 16 bits of LBA address
DE: low 16 bits of LBA address
l: number of sectors
IX: point to transfer area
Ouput: A error bits, L successfully transfered sectors, F: Z if no error

Function 12:
B: I/O command code
IX transfer area for the function 1-3 read registers
output: A error bits, F: Z if no error

At function 1: HL:DE card size (32 bit LBA)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.April.25. 11:29:35
And what I know about hw:
The SD segment divided to 3 area: ROM, RAM and I/O, now I'm using Page 3 addresses:
C000-DFFFh 8K ROM (it is can be paged, 8*8K total, using Flash ROM chip)
E000-FBFFh 7K RAM (using SRAM chip)
FC00-FFFFh I/O registers, 4 registers these are shadowed in all 4 bytes in the I/O area
FC00: R/W data register
FC01: W: Control: Bit 7: CS0, Bit 6: CS1, Bit 5: reset disk change
FC01: R: Status: Bit 7: WP1, Bit 6: INSRT0&INSRT1, Bit 5: DCHNG0 or DCHNG1
FC02: W: ROM page register
FC03: W: select high speed data read, Bit 7=1 HS enabled
In High Speed mode the Data register can be read at all address from FC00-FFFFh, then possible read sectors with LDIR instructions.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.April.25. 11:44:23
Quote from: Zozosoft
One question: the final version will be available with standard edge connection, for use with existing expansion?
I could provide a bus bridge compatible version if this is preferred, yes. I'd just need to change the edge connector for a card edge and I could also remove the 5v regulator. In the original design I have been thinking about your "average" Enterprise user who doesn't have things like the bus bridge or other devices, and just has an Enterprise. I think this describes most Enterprise owners in the UK. :)

Do you have direct access to the SPI bus from the cartridge hardware? By the looks of the description above there is some controller involved?

I can map the RAM / ROM how you like in the single segment. I had mapped 12K ROM, 4K RAM and 256b hardware, but this can change as you like.

I can look at adding things like a high speed read mode. At the moment you have direct control over the SPI hardware, and a read actually requires a write first. So you have to perform a byte write followed by a byte read from a register to read a byte from the card.

We can look at speeding things up (if we even need to!) when its working.

I created a JTAG programming adaptor for my JTAG edge connector on the expansion last night and was able to program the CPLD. It current freezes the Enterprise as I think it's constantly writing to the bus, so I'll debug that tonight... :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.April.25. 12:07:16
Quote from: Saint
Do you have direct access to the SPI bus from the cartridge hardware?
SPI conversion made by th CPLD, Z80 only R/W regular 8 bit data.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.April.25. 12:12:47
Quote from: Saint
I'd just need to change the edge connector for a card edge and I could also remove the 5v regulator.
Don't remove the regulator, and the edge connection same as the machine connection (2x33pin, 9V present). Look at card designed by Gyula Mészáros, this is the Hungarian standard :-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.April.25. 12:14:52
Quote from: Zozosoft
SPI conversion made by th CPLD, Z80 only R/W regular 8 bit data.
Ok, not as flexible as mine. :)

I even have a 2nd SPI header on the board so you can add your own SPI devices. If anyone creates a nice ethernet driver or something I'll happily create a new revision of the PCB with it built in... :cool:
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.April.25. 12:16:19
Quote from: Zozosoft
Don't remove the regulator, and the edge connection same as the machine connection (2x33pin, 9V present). Look at card designed by Gyula Mészáros, this is the Hungarian standard :-)
Oh, ok! So I just change the edge connector for a card edge, and that's it? Easy. :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.April.26. 01:04:02
Some progress tonight. Got the CPLD talking to the enterprise ok. I can detect the sd card inserted switch and write protect switch and write to the SPI bus all fine. But I've yet to get any response from the sd card. Not sure why, as the data going out looks ok...

More debugging to be drone!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.April.26. 09:23:52
SD Card need to be initialized after inserted. I call SD Disk Reset if Disk Change bit active.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: geo1977 on 2014.April.26. 10:02:16
@ saint if you have ready sd interface please not forget me ..!!!:lol:
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: lgb on 2014.April.26. 15:02:00
AFAIK, SD cards need initialization sequence including switching to SPI mode as most (?) SD cards has other modes too. If I remember correctly there are at least 74 (?) clock pulses as the part of the sequence. Then you can identify the card eg it can be powered safely with a given supply voltage (according the standard you should stop use otherwise - though technically SD cards should work with 3.3V voltage or so as power and signal level, some of them requires lower voltage and maybe it's not so OK to power them with 3.3 for too long - but I am not sure about this), and max SPI clock (till the identification you should use max of 400KHz). Please note that it's from my memory only now, I can be wrong, for sure. Also SD cards sometimes not behaves too well according to he SPI standard, they should work on SPI mode 0, but eg select signal is sometimes not handled as it should or with only a great delay. Also, inserting/ejecting SD card when powered needs some extra care, I would avoid it till the everything is OK (and then you need some solution to avoid dropping power level because of the initial high current eaten by the card at the time of inserting, usually an inductor or other solution needed and good power supply regulator)

Ok, instead of my blah-blah, I've managed to find this page again I used to check out when I played with SD cards with AVR MCUs: http://elm-chan.org/docs/mmc/mmc_e.html (http://elm-chan.org/docs/mmc/mmc_e.html) But it's also useful to read source of the SD2IEC firmware (partial Commodore floppy drive emulator using SD card), it's GNU/GPL. The page also has this nice diagram about the initialization sequence: http://elm-chan.org/docs/mmc/gx1/sdinit.png (http://elm-chan.org/docs/mmc/gx1/sdinit.png)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.April.28. 23:45:42
I've written SPI / SD CARD code before, so it wasn't as simple as that... :)

It turned out to be a dry solder joint on the MISO SD CARD socket, and also SDCC is buggy! It wasnt setting a bit correctly, so the packet being sent to the SD CARD was wrong.

So I've fixed those problems and I'm talking to the SD CARD, it's all initialised and I've read the card size etc and am ready to read data from it. Tomorrow I hope to actually read a sector, then if that works we're nearly ready to get it working with EXDOS. :mrgreen:

Zozo -- is it possible to have the source code from you for the EXDOS driver? I can then integrate it all here and get it working with my SD CARD code.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.May.01. 20:51:28
Thanks for the source Zozo, I have it. :)

Ok, some more progress. I've spent the last few nights working on the SPI chip hardware. The transfer was really unreliable and wouldn't work at any decent speed using the code that I had found (an Altera example project).

So I've rewritten the SPI interface from scratch and debugged it fully, and I now have it running at full speed (~7Mhz) with no errors. I can read a full 128K in under 2 seconds with no optimisation at all, which is plenty fast enough, so I don't think I'll worry about optimising the transfer speed. :lol:

Next is to get the EXDOS driver working.

Zozo -- where is your modified EXDOS ROM which I will need for the driver to work?

I'm starting to think about orders now as well. Could you see how many people are likely to want one of these over in Hungary Zozo? Also, would people want the card edge version, rather than my edge connector version?

I'm trying to think ahead as getting the PCB's made takes a little while.

And also, anyone else interested please let me know so I can start thinking about numbers. :)

I'll have to sit down and try and figure out a price as well! I've not looked at how much everything costs yet. Been too busy making hardware... :cool:
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Bagpuss22 on 2014.May.01. 21:12:36
AS always BP is interested  :ds_icon_cheesygrin:
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: BruceTanner on 2014.May.01. 22:28:35
Quote from: Saint
Also, would people want the card edge version, rather than my edge connector version?

I'm trying to think ahead as getting the PCB's made takes a little while.

Hi Saint, just wondering if you could do both versions with one PCB? Could the bottom row of holes of the edge connector actually be in the ”fingers” of a card edge? So don't fit the edge connector and you get a card edge, or fit the edge connector and ignore the card edge fingers? (You mentioned the possibility of making the PCB extend below the edge connector so it was at the same level as the base of the Enterprise...this might help.) Just an idea...I haven't looked at the dimensions or electrical connections!

Count me in for an edge connector one by the way...

B.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.May.01. 22:50:09
I was just thinking about the idea of one PCB for both the edge connector and card edge... :)

I cant do it with a through hole edge connector, however its possible with a straddle mount type. This would then give a lay-flat type connection to the Enterprise rather than the vertical mount. I'll see what I can source in the way of edge connectors...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: CiH on 2014.May.02. 00:09:18
Potentially interested here :-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: BruceTanner on 2014.May.02. 09:39:58
Quote from: Saint
This would then give a lay-flat type connection to the Enterprise rather than the vertical mount.
I didn't realise lay-flat was an option - I assumed you wanted a vertical one! In that case I wonder if it is possible to solder two conventional edge connectors back to back (I haven't tried it!)? Hopefully all the pins being soldered together would give enough mechanical strength and you could then just connect card edge to card edge.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.May.03. 22:12:57
Vertical is the way I like it to save desk space, but I try and accommodate people's requirements. :) soldering two edge connectors together is a good idea, actually. I've had a look and reckon they would be plenty strong enough.

And a bit of an update. I've been busy converting my SPI driver code into Z80 machine code from C to work with Zozo's driver. First time I've actually done any proper Z80 coding! I still prefer 68000... ;)

I wish I knew Z80 a bit better though, as I'm sure I could reuse most of the existing SPI code from the cartridge device. But I feel it's much safer to convert my known working code. :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: jltursan on 2014.May.11. 20:39:57
Count with me for at least one PCB!. I really like the vertical solution :-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: weirdocollector on 2014.May.11. 21:21:00
Hi everybody from Italy !

Please count me in for an SD interface: my EP128 will be happy to get it !

Thanks a lot in advance.

Fabio.
(Milan-ITALY)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Tricky on 2014.May.11. 21:46:56
Hi Saint,

Please count me in for an SD interface - happy with either version.

Cheers

Tricky
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.May.12. 00:16:27
Good to see some more interest gathering. :) I've now written and tested the z80 assembler version of the SD card code and its working perfectly. The hardware has been tweaked a bit as well.

So now I'm working on the interface to EXDOS with Zozo's driver code. Getting close... :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.May.12. 10:21:50
I'm not sure if I mentioned, but this expansion includes SD card interface, 512KB RAM (which I can put at any address, so if you have an internal 64K, 512KB or 1MB expansion, I can map lower to give you additional RAM) and 512KB FLASH ROM. The FLASH ROM will be managed from an EXOS extension, allowing you to select ROMs from EXDOS and flash them into the card so you can have up to 32 ROMs installed.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.May.12. 10:31:51
Quote
which I can put at any address, so if you have an internal 64K, 512KB or 1MB expansion, I can map lower to give you additional RAM

Cannot it be standardized ? Not for all expansions in the universe, but at least among your expansions, or with (maybe consulted with Zozo) most of the expansions ?

So you mapped the the inside expansions somewhere, and by default mapping the SD card versions somewhere else, and the third kind again somewhere else ?

So users could combine them as their wish by default, without collision in the most of the cases ?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.May.12. 11:05:00
Quote from: Z80System
Cannot it be standardized ? Not for all expansions in the universe, but at least among your expansions, or with (maybe consulted with Zozo) most of the expansions ?

So you mapped the the inside expansions somewhere, and by default mapping the SD card versions somewhere else, and the third kind again somewhere else ?

So users could combine them as their wish by default, without collision in the most of the cases ?
No.

The problem is, if you have an Enterprise 64, and would like to run 128 software, the RAM needs to include pages F8-FB. If you have an internal RAM expansion then this is covered, and the extra RAM could appear anywhere.

The address of the RAM is programmed into a GAL, so you would have to specify which version of the GAL you would like when ordering. Either one or Enterprise 64 to allow 128 compatibility, or one for extra RAM (which can be a set address for all machines which already have F8-FB mapped).

If I had thought about this more in the first place, I could have made this switchable by software, however as people either have an internal memory expansion or they don't, then two GAL's was easier.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.May.12. 11:20:57
Hmmm ... EP's hardware would support the segment address layout with a hw protocol or something ...

Different hw expansions would "register" their amount ... something central memory management hw would be good ...

At this time, it's too late to design such expandable hw memory management ... it seems (how you say) manual configurations is an absolutely need ...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.May.12. 11:25:51
Quote from: Z80System
At this time, it's too late to design such expandable hw memory management ... it seems (how you say) manual configurations is an absolutely need ...
I should add the only reason that the memory needs to be at F8-FB is because of "naughty" programs just assuming that these memory pages are available. If they had been written properly using the EXOS memory allocation, memory could be at any address and we would have no problem. :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.May.12. 11:29:03
Is it possible to add a jumper for EP64/128 selection? Many people have both types.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.May.12. 11:34:35
Quote
I should add the only reason that the memory needs to be at F8-FB is because of "naughty" programs just assuming that these memory pages are available.

In this case that would be the simplified approach (for plain users like me) if there would be a jumper, or something like that, and the different type of cards would be mapped at different places by default,

and if somebody want one of the card assembled currently mapped from f8 (because of EP64 case, or anything), then that jumper would be connected on a specific card. only for that card, what the user want to map from f8. multiple jumper connection at multiple cards is a collision and not supported ...

or somthing like this ...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.May.12. 11:38:11
Quote from: Zozosoft
Is possible add jumper for EP64/128 selection? Many people have both type.
Possibly, but not with the current PCB. I don't have any lines free on the GAL to be able to use as an input to alter the address decoding at the moment. But I could reduce the precision of the address decoding a little (from 256 bytes to 512 bytes) and add a jumper to set the spare pin high or low which would alter the address decoding. This would certainly be the best option for future revisions.

For most collectors, in the UK at least, a fixed memory mapping for the Enterprise 64 would be enough. So I can quite happily sell these boards to people who don't have the need for moving the memory address, and get some new boards made up with the jumper for those who need it.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.May.12. 11:39:25
Of course, the inside expansion cards already done, cannot have this feature ... but at the pluggable expansions maybe the need is bigger for flexibility ...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.May.12. 17:29:46
We must talk(better suggest) about the future of the interface. Saint has mentioned it will be an all in one expansion, usable for all the EP users, not conflicting with older expansions. 

If the 64k users memory problem  had been discussed earlier , now Saint could have an easy solution.


 He had mentioned his expansion card has space for more upgrading, and I think now is the time to propose things.


There are some obvious improvements yet made in the nineties of the past century....by the Mészáros team, easy to implement as they already have EXOS extensions or utilities(Zozotools), like Real Time Clock, Serial port(mouse) or Keyboard adapter, but what the EPs need more is real connexion with other computers or directly to the WEB. Now that the storage problem seems to be fixed.... 


Now is the time when every EP user can reach by few money that future the creators promised us but rarely was perceived on all that years.


But we must talk about it, please.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: lgb on 2014.May.12. 18:25:02
I know this is my boring idea again and again, but is it possible somehow to have some kind of solder points at least for external SPI bus usage besides the SD card? And of course the ability to choose SPI target between SPI external and SPI towards the SD card. As far as I know SD cards are not so nice players in the SPI game, so simply having to select signals for the two "targets" are not enough. :( At least I've read somewhere that SD cards sometimes not so nice to release the MOSI, MISO signals even if there are not selected, or very to slow to leave it/them floating ... But then it would require an external buffer/etc to really disconnect it from the SPI bus or having totally seperated SPI buses for the SD card and the external SPI bus (but that require extra pins from the CPLD to be used). Well, since not so many people are interested (I guess) I am not sure if it's worth to deal with this ....
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.May.12. 22:04:54
Quote from: lgb
I know this is my boring idea again and again, but is it possible somehow to have some kind of solder points at least for external SPI bus usage besides the SD card? And of course the ability to choose SPI target between SPI external and SPI towards the SD card. As far as I know SD cards are not so nice players in the SPI game, so simply having to select signals for the two "targets" are not enough. :( At least I've read somewhere that SD cards sometimes not so nice to release the MOSI, MISO signals even if there are not selected, or very to slow to leave it/them floating ... But then it would require an external buffer/etc to really disconnect it from the SPI bus or having totally seperated SPI buses for the SD card and the external SPI bus (but that require extra pins from the CPLD to be used). Well, since not so many people are interested (I guess) I am not sure if it's worth to deal with this ....
I have already brought a 2nd SPI device to a 6 pin header for people to use other SPI devices. I'm not sure about SD cards not playing nice, though. If their CS is deselected, they should set MISO to high impedance...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: lgb on 2014.May.13. 00:24:34
Quote from: Saint
I have already brought a 2nd SPI device to a 6 pin header for people to use other SPI devices.
Cool :) :)
Quote
I'm not sure about SD cards not playing nice, though. If their CS is deselected, they should set MISO to high impedance...
Yes, they should ...

And btw about the "useful other SPI device", I am still thinking on the ENC28J60. Even a ready-to-use module with RJ45, PCB etc costs about 4$ or so on ebay, as far as I can remember. But I should stop say these again and again as I will be banned off the forum soon :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.May.13. 09:45:38
Another configuration problem which is need to be handled:
With original machines using EXOS 2.0/2.1, 512K ROM can't be used, only two programs detected at x0h segments. And the RAM test with lot of RAM are also painful slowly :oops:
Solutions:
a) Upgrade onboard EXOS to 2.3+ version. But not all user can do it, and many machine which are nice, unopened don't wanted to open it.
b) Need a cartridge with cartridge version of my quick RAM test. Least additional ROM chip needed, but possible whole cartridge (if not want to modify original).
c) Decode interface ROM to cartridge address space (then 04h-23h area used), then possible run the quick test from the interface. Then do not use cartridge :-) It is another GAL program variation.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.May.13. 10:36:35
Quote from: Zozosoft
Another configuration problem which is need to be handled:
With original machines using EXOS 2.0/2.1, 512K ROM can't be used, only two programs detected at x0h segments. And the RAM test with lot of RAM are also painful slowly :oops:
Solutions:
a) Upgrade onboard EXOS to 2.3+ version. But not all user can do it, and many machine which are nice, unopened don't wanted to open it.
b) Need a cartridge with cartridge version of my quick RAM test. Least additional ROM chip needed, but possible whole cartridge (if not want to modify original).
c) Decode interface ROM to cartridge address space (then 04h-23h area used), then possible run the quick test from the interface. Then do not use cartridge :-) It is another GAL program variation.
Ah, right. So I'd need to map the FLASH ROM to the cartridge space. That's ok, I can do that. Is there any problem with having the FLASH mapped there in all versions? As if you want a cartridge, you can just use the flash manager to install it...

Also, is it possible to check and execute all ROM slots with older EXOS using a cartridge extension? Rather than just the 0-7 then x0-x3. It would be a shame to waste a lot of the 512K FLASH with older EXOS.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.May.13. 10:43:39
If it is mapped to the cartridge, then install my memory test program to 04h. It is can detect all ROMs.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.May.13. 10:51:38
Quote from: Zozosoft
If it is mapped to the cartridge, then install my memory test program to 04h. It is can detect all ROMs.
:smt040
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: NoP on 2014.May.13. 15:18:20
Count me in, too. I need one for my unmodified, unopened 128k German Enterprise computer. Also, I do not have any spare cartridges, so for me the ideal solution would be the one Zozo mentioned (mapping cartridge area into your expansion).
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.May.13. 15:27:26
Yes, the whole point of this expansion for me is giving everyone out there the ability to run all EP software straight from one plug and play device.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: lgb on 2014.May.13. 17:24:41
Quote from: Saint
Yes, the whole point of this expansion for me is giving everyone out there the ability to run all EP software straight from one plug and play device.

Just I miss the "like" button now :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.May.13. 23:15:00
Ok, final bugs tracked down, and I'm now playing some games on the Enterprise from SD card. :)

I need to add write support now and tidy things up, but its working..... :smt040
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.May.13. 23:20:04
Great!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: BruceTanner on 2014.May.14. 08:17:54
WoooooHooooo! :smt026
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: weirdocollector on 2014.May.14. 08:45:01
Hurrah for Saint !!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: jltursan on 2014.May.14. 20:36:16
Pics or it didn't happen! :lol:
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.May.14. 21:14:24
Quote from: jltursan
Pics or it didn't happen! :lol:
Soon... :)

Working on tidying up the code, then I'll stick some pics or a video or something up.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Bagpuss22 on 2014.May.14. 23:59:18
Quote from: Saint
Ok, final bugs tracked down, and I'm now playing some games on the Enterprise from SD card. :)

I need to add write support now and tidy things up, but its working..... :smt040
Awesome work :smt023
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.May.16. 00:27:35
I've been working on tidying up the SD card driver -- added a nice boot screen with hi-res text display. Some pictures of it working... :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: BruceTanner on 2014.May.16. 10:03:51
:):razz::ds_icon_cheesygrin::mrgreen::bow:
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: fatbob_gb on 2014.May.16. 10:35:54
Quote from: BruceTanner
:):razz::ds_icon_cheesygrin::mrgreen::bow:
+Loads :mrgreen:
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.May.16. 11:20:43
:smt041
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: lgb on 2014.May.16. 11:37:31
Woooo, cool, really :) Now this combined rom+ram+sd solution (with external SPI) does everything I was thinking about in the past. Except one: some kind a - let's name it - "short bus" to easly add simple hardwares (which are not SPI) doing only 8 bit I/O and some pre-decoded select signals etc with more compact connector. But besides that it can do everything now, most people would ever require :) A typical example for this: adding an RTC chip. Otherwise you would require to decode the I/O port, the control bus signals etc and you also need a large, not so easy to get/build connector just to connect a little IC onto your lovely EP :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.May.16. 11:38:19
Quote from: Saint
I need to add write support now
If it is done, then try to test with this little program: for the first run create 4MB TESTFILE.BIN with pseudo random numbers.
At the second run when the .BIN exist verify it.
If error found then halt with flashing border color, if all ok will return to ENTERPRISE screen.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.May.17. 10:19:41
Thanks Zozo! I wrote the write sector code and added the correct status bits for other routines last night, but haven't had a chance to test yet. This program will be very useful, thanks! :)

I'll see if I have room on the PCB / CPLD for a generic I/O port on the next revision of the PCB as well... :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: jltursan on 2014.May.18. 23:06:13
Woot!, it happened! :ds_icon_cheesygrin:

Really impressive work! :smt038
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: weirdocollector on 2014.May.19. 09:12:53
A good way to start the week ! :ds_icon_cheesygrin:

Thanks a lot Saint !
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.May.20. 21:15:24
Quote from: Zozosoft
If it is done, then try to test with this little program: for the first run create 4MB TESTFILE.BIN with pseudo random numbers.
At the second run when the .BIN exist verify it.
If error found then halt with flashing border color, if all ok will return to ENTERPRISE screen.
Getting some weird results here. I can create and delete directories with MKDIR and RMDIR from an EXDOS prompt, but running this test program fails (border flashing).

Could I have the source code Zozo, so I can put some logging in and try and figure out what is happening? Not sure if its maybe the verify routine which isn't working right...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.May.20. 21:52:12
0) border flashing, or slowly changing color? (it is happen at each 16K read/write, for a lifesign :) )
1) are you using EXDOS 1.4?
2) for EXDOS operations try to switch on VERIFY, :VAR 70 ON
3) there is the source
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.May.20. 21:58:13
Quote from: Zozosoft
0) border flashing, or slowly changing color? (it is happen at each 16K read/write, for a lifesign :) )
1) are you using EXDOS 1.4?
2) for EXDOS operations try to switch on VERIFY, :VAR 70 ON
3) there is the source
Ahhh, it's slowly changing colour. I just thought there was an error, but it must be working! :oops:

Thanks for the info on verify, I'll try that out, and thanks for the source. :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.May.20. 22:19:16
Ok, I left it for a while and it created a 4mb file, then verified ok. So it looks like write is working file... :)

I just have the flash manager to finish off now and tidy up the flash location for the cartridge space etc. Getting close to finishing. :ds_icon_cheesygrin:
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.May.21. 15:31:43
Where can I find the fast RAM test ROM Zozo?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.May.21. 15:40:13
Quote from: Saint
Where can I find the fast RAM test ROM Zozo?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.May.21. 22:51:11
Great, thanks Zozo. I now have it booting on my old unmodified Enterprise with the fast ram test and SD CARD interface working.

Just the flash rom manager to finish now...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: weirdocollector on 2014.July.16. 00:43:14
Hi,

any further progress on this project?

Thanks in advance.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.July.16. 10:32:37
I'm basically ready to make them now, I just need to sort out the edge connector. As it is, I just have a cut end edge connector, which is quite easy to connect to the Enterprise misaligned, so it wont work. I need to come up with some end caps for the edge connector to make sure it connects correctly. This has been what is holding me up...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.July.16. 11:56:12
Cut a 2 pins longer connector and on both side solder the extra pair of pins, got a end barriers at both side.
If the original end of the connector are "EP compatible" then can be used, and need to do the extra pin soldering at the other side.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.July.16. 12:08:41
Thanks for the tip, I will try. It looked like it would be too wide for the Enterprise case, I guess it will just fit!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: jltursan on 2014.July.16. 19:24:02
Great news anyway!, seems that the thougest part is already finished :-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: StarshipUK on 2014.September.02. 00:58:37
I notice the last post was in July. Is this available to purchase yet please?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: dmacoco on 2014.September.10. 03:56:54
Hello,

I'm a french fan of this computer, with its fantastic abilities. This sd interface will allow enterprise users to try games, and making our enterprise to be more alive
This SD interface will allow me to use it easily again. 

How saying to the creator of the interface to take me in account in case of going in a production phase of the card.
Thanks.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.September.10. 15:18:53
Quote from: dmacoco
How saying to the creator of the interface to take me in account in case of going in a production phase of the card.
Article about the Hungarian SD Card Cartridge project. (http://szergitata.blog.hu/2014/07/13/enterprise_128_sd_adapter_quick_start_guide_uk)
You can find the email address where you can get more informations.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: BruceTanner on 2014.September.10. 19:59:42
Wow, looks good!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: jltursan on 2014.September.11. 11:05:03
Yep, cool!

What happened to Saint's one?, is it still being developed or has it been superseded by this one?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.September.11. 11:36:48
As far as I know, these are paralell projects with no cooperation.

Saint's one is an expansion port device, with ram (and maybe rom) expansion, too.

The hungarian one is a cartridge solution, with rom, and 8k special writeable memory, but no normal ram expansion.

I hope there is no superseeding or such, I would like to get some of Saint's devices, too.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.September.11. 11:49:22
Quote from: Z80System
no cooperation.
Not fully true!
The Hungarian interface are the first working solution.

Then I suggested few technical details to Saint (for example the shared ROM/RAM segment for the SD driver), and I passed my EXDOS expansion code to Saint. He added own HW handling code to it. At the user level both will working same.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: jltursan on 2014.September.11. 12:02:06
So then it would be great to have not one; but two mass storage devices for the Enterprise :)

I'm eager to see one of them fully working (the hungarian one seems pretty close to be 100% operational, isn't it?)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.September.11. 12:12:02
As far as I know, some of us already using one of the 1.0 version of the cards.

I did not hear any complaint, yet. But in this 1.0 form, the card is not available anymore.

They developed an other "Premium" version of the card, and the first batch of these "Premium" cards is in construction phase ...

Till now, I do not hear a person using the Premium version in practice. We wait them impatiently ... :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: jltursan on 2014.September.11. 12:30:58
:smt026 /me waiting
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: weirdocollector on 2014.September.11. 16:11:37
Same here :ds_icon_cheesygrin: :smt026
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: JCCyC on 2014.September.17. 01:24:22
(http://www.retrocomputaria.com.br/plus/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2013/10/Shut-Up-And-Take-My-Money.gif)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.September.18. 13:36:33
There is some progress with the cartridge SD card controller Premium version:

http://indafoto.hu/szorg/ep128_sd_adapter_premium

First batch of the panels arrived, first card is assembled, never tested, yet. :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.September.18. 15:18:15
My expansion is basically finished, I've just been lacking the time recently to get it all finalised and some units built. :roll:

Good to see the cartridge expansion!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.September.18. 15:23:16
Cool! Some of us are waiting that, too ! :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.September.18. 15:35:02
I've decided to get on with it and try and get some built up -- hope to have a small batch (like 5 or so) ready for sale in a few weeks, then more to follow. Mostly it'll be waiting on components... :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.September.18. 15:40:21
Okay, tell us when we can "sign in" or something,
or maybe Zozo will gather a "hungatian batch" when he arrives back from the mountains,
so tell us what are our options when those options are already available.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.September.18. 16:36:52
What will happen when we are using a cartridge SD controller and other EXDOS extension devices together ? :)

IDE controller card (what is an EXDOS extension device, too) can work together with the WD floppy controller, by design.

But the cartridge SD has EXDOS and its own SDEXT, what will happen if I connect an EXDOS card with floppy controller, or Saint's combined RAM/ROM/SD card what will probably contain an own EXDOS and its SDEXT like extension ?

Can anybody say it ? :)

Will these be "use by itself alone" devices ?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.September.18. 16:53:03
Any EXDOS extension can be combined, only limit: Z are the last drive letter :-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.September.18. 16:58:51
Quote
Any EXDOS extension can be combined, only limit: Z are the last drive letter (http://enterpriseforever.com/Smileys/phpbb/ds_icon_smile.gif)

Okay, it is then the hardware side and the EXDOS extension software side,

but what will be with the multiple and different EXDOS ROM instances ?

I will have to reduce to only one EXDOS ROM instance in my system ? And if my system will have a WD floppy controller chip, I will have to reduce to a WD compatible (original) EXDOS ROM, and when I have no WD chip in my system, I will have to reduce to a single EXDOS ROM without WD chip support ?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.September.18. 16:59:56
Quote
Any EXDOS extension can be combined, only limit: Z are the last drive letter (http://enterpriseforever.com/Smileys/phpbb/ds_icon_smile.gif)
And there will not be name collisions, like SDEXT, or something ?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.September.18. 17:08:42
In the other side,

what have been with the quick(advanced) ram test(detection) side of the saint's combined extension ?

Will it work plugging into a stock machine, finally ? Or have I to burn quick test to the cartridge or the mainboard ?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.September.18. 17:11:18
And how can I change the ROMs in the extension ? Is there a software done for it, already ? I can change the ROMs as simple as I can with the cartridge SD card's ROM segments ?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.September.18. 17:52:45
The fast test is mapped into the onboard flash on the expansion. Currently there is no flashing software (I haven't had time to write it), so you would have to flash any additional ROM's manually. However it wouldn't be difficult to write a flashing program if someone wanted to do this... :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.September.18. 18:00:26
Quote
The fast test is mapped into the onboard flash on the expansion.
Hmmm ... I thought the fast test can be placed only into the cartridge or into the mainboard rom.


Quote
 so you would have to flash any additional ROM's manually

What does it mean "manually" ? With an external device, or something ?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.September.18. 18:01:25
I have a FLASH program. The best way extend this to universal FLASH program.
Your card use which type of FLASH chip?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.September.18. 18:04:35
Hmmm ... I thought the fast test can be placed only into the cartridge or into the mainboard rom.
If the card ROM decoded to cartridge address space, then fast test can be used with stock machine. (No cartridge can be used in this situation.)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Saint on 2014.September.18. 18:04:55
I decode the cartridge address space... ah, which does mean of course, you cant run a cartridge as well as this expansion. I designed this as a "plug and play" device for any Enterprise, which will give you RAM / ROM and SD card, fast RAM test and latest BASIC.

Flash is an SST39SF040 :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.September.18. 18:11:04
Quote
If the card ROM decoded to cartridge address space, then fast test can be used with stock machine. (No cartridge can be used in this situation.)

Does the cartridge decode to fix position, cannot I change to other place ?

So if saint's extension maps to the cartridge place, cartridge will be an other place ?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.September.18. 18:13:18
Quote
I decode the cartridge address space... ah, which does mean of course, you cant run a cartridge as well as this expansion.
Cannot somebody change the decoding of the expansion ROM to other places in those cases, when they have already a quick test in the cartridge or in the mainboard rom ?

With jumpers or some programming of something in the card ? :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.September.18. 18:22:20
Against the confusion:

I would like to get this device when it will be possible,
it does not depend on the cartridge thing,
I'm only asking to know ... :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.September.18. 18:27:42
I also want to have both! :-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.September.18. 19:11:17
And I....
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Bagpuss22 on 2014.September.19. 10:30:27
Me too, please ;-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: geo1977 on 2014.September.20. 05:15:09
@saint
i want one please
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Stefan on 2014.September.21. 23:34:47
Quote from: Saint
I've decided to get on with it and try and get some built up -- hope to have a small batch (like 5 or so) ready for sale in a few weeks, then more to follow. Mostly it'll be waiting on components... :)

hello,

i am a collector from germany and really interested in your SD Floppy Replacement

please put me on your list
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: weirdocollector on 2014.September.22. 09:28:17
Count me in for both, please ! :ds_icon_cheesygrin:
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.September.22. 10:20:49
Quote
I also want to have both! (http://enterpriseforever.com/Smileys/phpbb/ds_icon_smile.gif)
What "both" are you interested in ? It is one device, isn't it ?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.September.22. 13:21:20
Quote from: Z80System
What "both" are you interested in ? It is one device, isn't it ?
One is the Hungarian, the other one is from Saint.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.September.22. 13:26:58
Quote
One are the Hungarian another one from Saint.
Okay, it is clear now,
but in this context this thing was confusing,
especially how we know, the hungarian cartridge SD controller can be "ordered" (signed on) only on it's e-mail address,

and now, these "signings" was for the saint's one.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.September.22. 13:44:38
Not a signing, is only to say Saint that some of us want to have the two cards and both be compatibles.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.September.22. 13:53:57
Quote
Not a signing, is only to say Saint

Yes, maybe I do not know the appropriate meaning of "signing" I just try to use "signing" instead of "ordering",
but maybe signing is to strong, too.

Quote
that some of us want to have the two cards and both be compatibles.
Ahhh ... you think that You and Zozo just tried to support me with the hope of compatibility ?

I'm not sure, that Zozo think of it ...

But the compatibility (or the switchable compatibility, because the single (incompatible) working is important, too, how saint designed the thing) would be good, of course.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.September.22. 14:33:56
You, Zozo or I are speaking of the same thing(incompatibilities), but there are others that think we are signing(it is the right meaning) to obtain a SD-card adapter...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.September.22. 14:44:13
Remember Z80System, neither English is my motherly(native) language....

Here we write "Inglish"... and we manage to understand each other...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: geo1977 on 2014.September.24. 05:03:19
may ask something ..? the other sd interface  hungarian project we declare interest from here or
we sent email to vortyex because  i sent but until now nothing... if yes im interesting for both
(Saint and vortyex)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.September.24. 11:34:05
Quote
we sent email to vortyex because  i sent but until now nothing

Hmmm ... I just wrote a mail, asking SzörG,
and he said, he already answered the mails he got,
the answering can usually take a few days (sometimes a week, too :)),
but if you write your letter formerly than a week,
you can try to write another mail and after that we have to figure out something,
like false positive spam hit, or something ...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.September.24. 11:37:13
SzörG himself is rarely here, and he posts more rarely.

He is usually a "quiet" one.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: geo1977 on 2014.September.24. 14:56:16
ok vortyex answer me today  and im happy i waiting now both sd like little child ....!!!!!!!!!!!!:ds_icon_cheesygrin:
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.November.05. 09:04:56
Premium version of the SD cartridge (can be fitted to the original cartridge case). (http://szergitata.blog.hu/2014/10/31/enterprise_128_sd_adapter_premium_valtozat)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Prodatron on 2014.November.05. 19:00:33
Is it still possible to get one of these? I am afraid that I am a little bit late...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.November.05. 19:13:42
Is it still possible to get one of these? I am afraid that I am a little bit late...
Write to the creator: vortyex at freemail dot hu
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.November.05. 19:14:34
No, it is definetly not late (to get one of those),

you have to write an e-mail to the address:

vortyex at freemail dot hu

signing to one of those cards.



Vortyex unfortunately can produce these cards more slowly than our demand,
there are people already in the queue who will get their cards only in the next year,

but I think that would be great (or important), you would get your card more early ...

So if you tell him (in e-mail) you make the SymbOS, maybe he can do something ...

If I were him, I simply make you first in the queue ... Of course, I do not know, he can do that ...

The only fast way to communicate him is that mail address.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.November.05. 19:34:42
If vortyex cannot give you a preference and this would make SymbOS development slower,
then I can give you my SD card which is not a "Premium" card, but one of the first version of the SD card,
it is 100% compatible to the "Premium" version (as far as I know), the main difference is only the form factor ...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Prodatron on 2014.November.07. 11:44:05
I am glad, that it's still possible to order it, so I wrote to Vortyex today :)
@Z80System: Thanks a lot for your nice offer! Let's first see, how long it will take. And on SymbOS side it will take probably one month until I am at a point where I can start with the SD card driver. First I should finish most other parts of the Enterprise port. If producing new cards takes too long, I would be really glad, if you could borrow your card for 2-3 weeks for testing it with SymbOS...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.November.07. 18:47:58
Okay, we will do this.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2014.November.07. 19:19:34
A little patience Dudes! :-)
The first dose of "Premium" SD Adapter is not finished yet!
I need 2-3 weeks I think. :oops:
We expect the manufacturer, then quality control, programming, test ...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.November.07. 19:46:27
Yes, we are patient ... like children in the sweet store ... :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2014.November.13. 12:46:08
Some news!

ENTERPRISE 128 Premium SD adaptor - Final countdown ;-)
The first dose hardware is complete. Programming and testing phase right now ...
approx a week:-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.November.13. 12:48:17
Great news!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: TomPhobos on 2014.December.07. 17:56:28
Aaah, i wasn't here for a longer time and now i read about an SD-card interface! Great news, i definitely need one! :D
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2014.December.07. 21:18:05
Aaah, i wasn't here for a longer time and now i read about an SD-card interface! Great news, i definitely need one! :D

The "Premium" version currently out of stock, the next realization at beginning 2015...
:-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: TomPhobos on 2014.December.08. 19:04:57
Ah, nice, please count me in :) How much does it cost? I haven't found any price ;)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Starej_Mraf on 2014.December.09. 10:58:59
I want one too... :) I haven't found any price too...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2014.December.09. 11:06:40
You have to write an e-mail to:

vortyex at freemail dot hu

You can ask the price, or sign up to an SD card at that e-mail address.
Vortyex communicates the "orders" only by e-mail.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Bagpuss22 on 2014.December.10. 00:53:56
Mine was shipped today :ds_icon_cheesygrin:

Question, Is there a limit on the number of partitions I can have?  I have a 1GB SD card
and I know it currently works with FAT12 which has a limit of 32Mbyte.

Cheers

Russ
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.December.10. 08:53:48
Question, Is there a limit on the number of partitions I can have?  I have a 1GB SD card
and I know it currently works with FAT12 which has a limit of 32Mbyte.
Just the drive letters :-) from F: to Z:
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Bagpuss22 on 2014.December.10. 19:25:40
Thanks Zozo.

Are you working on the FAT16 side of this?

I am assuming at the moment this is NOT compatible with the floppy
interface, as Gergely did make reference to this.

Regards

Russ
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.December.10. 20:01:21
Are you working on the FAT16 side of this?
Will be working on it. The SD driver supports it, EXDOS needs to be modified.
But first I need to finish the EXDOS 1.4 :oops:

Quote
I am assuming at the moment this is NOT compatible with the floppy
interface, as Gergely did make reference to this.
It is compatible.
Just a big bug in the EXDOS, it will freeze if WD177x is not present. It happens before the ENTERPRISE screen...
Then for the SD interface at default modified EXDOS installed to the ROM, where the floppy DISKIO returns immediately with "Not ready" error, then the code with the bug does not run.
It is possible to install normal EXDOS version to the SD interface and using both SD and floppy. But with this configuration the EXDOS card always needs to be connected.
It is also possible not to install any EXDOS to SD interface, using the EXDOS ROM from the EXDOS card. In this situation  the EXDOS card ROM should be upgraded to version 1.4 because the big bug found (file system damage in expanded EXDOS system).

This "WD not present" bug is the most impotant to do for the final EXDOS 1.4, when done then there's no need for separate versions for non-floppy and with-floppy systems.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Bagpuss22 on 2014.December.10. 23:14:28
OK.

I am assuming that, for now, I can run the SD card without the floppy interface and all will be well.

Russ
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2014.December.20. 22:16:19
I've found that Isdos doesn't start if not present the A: floppy disk, but that can be bypassed with ASSIGN a: f:

On the other hand, now that the "big" partitions allow  different GUIs in the same drive..... I need a way to start EGI, Basic or SymbOS.

But CP/M 2.2 (ISDOS) doesn't  have conditionals to do real batch files and I've found a powerful shell that loads on ISDOS. I don't know if any of you know of it, so I must do more test. Simply extract the files on the root directory or on other created for that and execute sh at the prompt. There is a PDF showing its usage.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.December.22. 11:38:07
FDISK 0.8 (http://enterpriseforever.com/programozas/ep-s-fdisk-fejlesztese/?action=dlattach;attach=11335) now supports both IDE and SD drives.

At the partition list, press C on "undefinied" entry to create a new partition. Currently only primary partitions can be created.
For the next step select the free block from the free space list. Then you need to enter the type byte (1=FAT12, 4=FAT16, 6=BIGDOS, 12=FAT32, etc), default 1 = FAT12.
The start sector has to be inside the free block, the default is the first sector of free block. Size in sectors, the default is 65535 =32M. For default value just press enter.
After creating the partitions the system needs cold restart so that the IDE/SD driver detect the new partitions, and use EXDOS FORMAT command to format new partitions.
(Will be added format option)

At the partition list, pressing CTRL+DEL on an existing partition will delete it, you need to answer capital Y to the are-you-sure question to execute the deletion.

Pressing Enter on Extended partition will list the logical drives, other operations will come... :oops:

ESC leaves the current list.


The program was written in IS-BASIC, thanks for Bruce! :-D I think you can't do similar in other BASICs.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: dmacoco on 2014.December.26. 15:01:35
Hello,

I've received my sd interface and tried it on my sixty-four.

It works fine but it seems that memory is a big barrier for a lot of software having "insufficient memory" for a large number of softwares
Does anybody have a solution ?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2014.December.26. 15:16:44
It works fine but it seems that memory is a big barrier for a lot of software having "insufficient memory" for a large number of softwares
Yes, only these games (http://ep128.hu/Ep_Games/Games_Ep64.htm) are compatible with 64K machines.

Quote
Does anybody have a solution ?
The best way is to buy internal memory expansion from Saint. (http://enterpriseforever.com/hardware/exp1-and-exp2-pinouts/)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2015.January.03. 19:04:06
FDISK 0.9 (http://enterpriseforever.com/programozas/ep-s-fdisk-fejlesztese/?action=dlattach;attach=11376)
Enhanced Extended partition handling:
-The list now includes the free spaces.
-By pressing C you can create partition (called as logical drive in DOS/Windows) in the extended partition, similar to the primary partition creation.
-Existing partition can be deleted from Extended, pressing CTRL+DEL, similar to the primary deletion.
-In the Extended list you can switch to Advanced list mode with CTRL+L where all detailed information is displayed. CTRL+N switches back to normal mode

Now empty SD Card (or IDE hdd) can be fully partitioned on the Enterprise. I suggest one 32M FAT12 for the first primary, SymbOS can be loaded from here, and additional Extended with another 8 FAT12 partitions for the EXDOS and Enterprise programs. Rest of the space is optional, for example FAT16 or FAT32 for the SymbOS.

After the partitioning, a cold restart is needed to redetect and format the new partitions.
In the version 1.0 Quick Format option will come.

[ATTACH=1]
[ATTACH=2]
[ATTACH=3]
[ATTACH=4]
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: BruceTanner on 2015.January.03. 21:46:45
Wow! Looks impressive! :ds_icon_cheesygrin:

Can I suggest a few lines at the bottom of the screen saying C=Create etc :?:
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2015.January.03. 21:53:30
Wow! Looks impressive! :ds_icon_cheesygrin:
Written in IS-BASIC :-D

Quote
Can I suggest a few lines at the bottom of the screen saying C=Create etc :?:
Ok, will be added in 1.0 :-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2015.January.05. 00:13:31
Happy (New) Retro Year Everyone! :-)
The next dose of ENTERPRISE 128 SD Adapter at February 2015 (a few weeks delay possible).
I changed my email address, I hope better than the previous. :-)
vortyex at gmail dot com
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2015.January.23. 11:40:36
Some news:
The SD Adapter Premium PCB's is under manufacturing! :-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: TomPhobos on 2015.January.24. 01:27:51
Great, i'm looking forward to it :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2015.January.27. 11:27:31
Trick for the stupid Microsoft Windows:
On partitioned SD Card it is only mounting the first partition, because... just...
With USB HDD no problem. Only one bit difference in the driver, it can be solved by hacking the card reader driver, see in google "flip removable bit".

Without driver hacking:
I bought a SD to SATA converter and put it to external USB 2.5" HDD case. Now the SD Card is HDD, and the Windows sees all Enterprise partitions! :-)
(For the HDD case my favorite is the Kingston SNA-DC/U because of the very easily removable cover.)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2015.January.27. 22:30:09
Updated VHD file, now including SymbOS :-)
Two partitions have been added to the "full of Enterprise programs VHD", partitions:
F: SymbOS main, there are two preconfigured SYMBOS.INI saved, .SD for using normal sized SD Card, .MSD for Micro SD. Select and copy the proper version as .INI (depending which card are you using)
The easy file browser/loader also on drive F: as START file, just press F1 key.

G: secondary SymbOS
The SymCommander configured for F: and G: as default.

H: Enterpise games from 0 to H
I: Enterpise games from I to R
J: Enterpise games from S to Z, software CPC emulator + programs, software Spectrum emulator + programs
K: Enterprise Demos
L: Enterprise music and videos
M: Enterprise utils

Download 256M VHD (http://enterprise.iko.hu/EP_IDE256M.ZIP)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Schombi on 2015.January.28. 17:00:21
Cool, thanks for updating.

One problem I came across so far is that SymCommander does not start at all. Neither from the desktop, nor from the Start menu. I still need to upgrade my RAM, so I´m running with 128KB only, but I guess that´s not the reason. From EXDOS I did a copy symbos.sd symbos.ini and this was taken. Everything else (games, demos etc.) is there. Maybe I did something silly?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2015.January.28. 17:49:43
SymCommander needs a little more of memory, but you can search and run other apps from Start/Run if I remember...

Talk with Saint (http://enterpriseforever.com/pm/?sa=send;u=322) for more memory. 1MB is only 20 pounds+pp...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: edoz on 2015.February.03. 22:15:25
SymCommander needs a little more of memory, but you can search and run other apps from Start/Run if I remember...

Talk with Saint (http://enterpriseforever.com/pm/?sa=send;u=322) for more memory. 1MB is only 20 pounds+pp...

Yes that is possible.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Schombi on 2015.February.04. 19:06:11
Thanks. I got one from Saint already. Could not fit it yet, due to work.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2015.February.15. 10:52:04
some news:
Technical problem at the manufacturer's, with the production of SD Adapter PCB's
(chemical plating and gold plating) ... :shock:
This caused a few weeks delay!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: edoz on 2015.February.25. 16:33:16
Ok .. could happen ;)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2015.February.26. 09:47:42
great disturbance in the force ... :shock:
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2015.May.03. 10:23:28
Demonstration video from SzörG (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wjG3citcbTE)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: pear on 2015.May.03. 10:44:37
I want it !
Where it buy, or if it is not a secret project I can do one copy for myself ?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2015.May.03. 10:48:25
SzörG is producing the hw, write him: vortyex at gmail dot com
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Tuby128 on 2015.May.03. 12:47:28
Demonstration video from SzörG (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wjG3citcbTE)

At 1:37 why is so small the unused memory? From ca. 1024kB only 13kB available.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2015.May.03. 17:38:59
Because smalldemo takes all the Ram available. That is a soft reset after it.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: ssr86 on 2015.May.16. 12:38:06
Does anyone know a free tool that allows copying files to the vhd for use with the sd adapter?
The free version of partition guru doesn't let you do that...
Which do you use?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2015.May.16. 12:56:35
In Windows 7 (or later) you can mount the VHD as hard disk.
Other way: buy SD to SATA converter and put to external 2.5" USB Sata hdd case. Then you can access all partitions of the EP SD card. (Or hack the SD reader driver, look in google: flip removable bit)
The first partition allways can be accessed.
As I know Linux see all partitions without any trick.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: ssr86 on 2015.May.16. 13:21:08
ok, works fine in win8 too:oops:
When I've tried earlier my computer hanged quite hard so I assumed that win8 can't deal with the particular format of vhd you use and didn't try again after that. Partition guru had no problems reading it but I couldn't copy files to the sd.:oops:
(I've always had talent for asking stupid questions)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: StarshipUK on 2015.May.16. 22:32:52
I sent an E-Mail to SzörG using the address shown a few posts back, but have not heard any thing back yet. Are these still available to purchase please?

I hope I am not being impatient, but do not want to miss out on one of these. Very excited :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2015.May.16. 23:02:30
Sorry for the late answer, so little time have ...
Now sold out, but we produce more Sd Adapter shortly :-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: slugman on 2015.July.10. 12:55:36
Now sold out, but we produce more Sd Adapter shortly :-)

Hi SzörG, I sent you a PM to see if you have an ETA for availability. Eager to add such interface into my machine ;-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2015.July.27. 22:18:43
Hi All!

The next batch of  Enterprise Premium SD Adapter for pre-order :-)
Planned release in 2015 August -September month.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: StarshipUK on 2015.September.13. 22:39:01
Hi All!

The next batch of  Enterprise Premium SD Adapter for pre-order :-)
Planned release in 2015 August -September month.

I am not sure if you got it (as not showing in Sent Messages), but I sent you a PM about purchasing one (I asked back in May).

Please let me know if this is possible and the details.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2015.September.18. 14:04:53
Thanks! I picked up the pre-order.
Unfortunately, the adapter is not ready yet :-(
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: dmacoco on 2015.October.11. 18:02:49
Hello

Does anybody have the stl file for 3d printing of a cartridge to keep protected my sd interface.
Or does it make sense to create it ?

Ooops ... i've found it on facebook enterprise group :
http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:1003869

Thanks for it.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2015.October.11. 18:14:20
Look at here. (http://www.thingiverse.com/Laci70/designs)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: ssr86 on 2015.October.12. 19:45:12
How much did it cost you (all who have got it 3d printed)?
Did you get it out of PLA or ABS?

I asked for some offers but for now got only two in return and an ABS version was about 27euro around here (I was looking for comanies in the city I work in)...
The PLA was around 16euro...

Should I look some more or are these prices not that bad for one set...?

Is it hard to finish such 3d printed case?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2015.October.12. 22:45:21
I have mine from.... an unused Basic cartridge.

The Premium version has the exact dimensions, I only had to work a little slot on the joint of the two halves for the opening of the sd-card bay.

I still have unused the Micro-SD bay, but I've planned to put in it the permanent files as it is blocked by the case and I don't want to open a big hole to access it.

If  some day  a good option is offered I will re-assemble the Basic cartridge. I don't like the finish of the actual 3-d printing technology...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: ssr86 on 2015.October.13. 22:31:55
I have mine from.... an unused Basic cartridge.
Unfortunately I don't have one...

The Premium version has the exact dimensions, I only had to work a little slot on the joint of the two halves for the opening of the sd-card bay.

Quote
If  some day  a good option is offered I will re-assemble the Basic cartridge. I don't like the finish of the actual 3-d printing technology...
I don't know much about 3d-print. What do you mean about the finish?

Has anyone tried printing the case and could share some photos after print and when finished (and maybe how much did it cost)?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2015.October.13. 22:48:23
You can see two real photos on the web-page:

(http://thingiverse-production-new.s3.amazonaws.com/renders/8c/0c/8b/ea/ed/IMG_20150902_113537_preview_featured.jpg)
(http://thingiverse-production-new.s3.amazonaws.com/renders/b5/61/fd/b3/fa/IMG_20150902_113602_preview_featured.jpg)

The pictures have bad resolution, but you can see the stratification produced by the 3d printing process.

I've seen other pieces with the same production method and the finished things are only approximations to the 3d object. They are full of edges and imperfections and need to be sanded and painted to really look  finished.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: dmacoco on 2015.October.20. 21:38:38
Hello, here are the pics of my 3D printing.
I've done it in a fablab in france. It costs me about 12€ (2h20 of printing both sides at 5€/h).

They have some good printers like makerbot replicator 2 and an ultimaker 2 extended.

I'm very happy for this solution.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2015.October.20. 22:04:14
Hmmm ... I hope there will be such places in Hungary, soon.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: elecdrum on 2015.October.27. 16:06:18
I've had an sd interface for a couple of months but only managed to get around to trying it yesterday. I'm getting constant crashes with it. For instance if I use the old basic rom I've always used it will sit on the word processing page for hours no problem. With the sd interface however it will crash or corrupt the screen within ten minutes. I'm wondering if I have a problem with my 128. Does anyone have any ideas on how to get to the bottom of what the fault could be? All games also crash and even exdos crashes.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2015.October.27. 18:29:59
It is an obvious answer, but try cleaning the contacts...

Sometimes my EP starts checking the memory like the stock rom, not with Zozo checker. This is signal of the SD-reader Rom not recognised. Then I switch off and extract and enter repeatedly the cart and  when I switch on it works perfect.

You also can use a contact-cleaner spray.

Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2015.October.27. 18:31:19
I'm very happy for this solution.

It is good looking!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2015.October.27. 20:06:26
Another idea: press down the ALT when power on the machine, then it is run in EP64 mode.
If no crash in BASIC then try to run EP64 compatible games. (http://www.ep128.hu/Ep_Games/Games_Ep64.htm) If still no problem then try with the old BASIC cartridge, enter the OUT 191,12 command and see it is will crashing?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Jolaes76 on 2015.November.23. 09:21:38
Comrade Szergej,

any news of the 2nd batch of the SD wonder weapon ?
hogy áll a második generációs SD csodafegyver gyártása ? :)

üdv.
Zsolt
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2015.December.05. 23:06:57
Hi All!

I need a little patience ...
I have a lot of problems lately :-(
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: StarshipUK on 2015.December.30. 00:03:15
I am not sure if you got it (as not showing in Sent Messages), but I sent you a PM about purchasing one (I asked back in May).

Please let me know if this is possible and the details.

I am not sure if anyone can help me please. I have posted interest in purchasing this since 16th May 2015, sent several private messages and even a message on facebook after seeing these were being produced on another forum (possibly atariage?) and waited, and waited patiently.

I do not wish to annoy, but do not know what else to do to be able to purchase one of these. I would really, really like to obtain one of these, and do not want it to get tot the stage where they are no longer available to buy.

If anyone can please help, or even if anyone has one they are not using that they would be able to sell to myself I would be very grateful if they could please contact me.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Jolaes76 on 2015.December.30. 15:45:34
If it is not available in the foreseeable future (and Sergej has not already invested in the parts) we might fall back to Pear's CF adapter... IF there are enough people to persuade him to make a small batch. Naturally, If Sergej has started the second SD adapter batch, I am not backing down from my pre-order.
I am not requiring anything fancy - if it can read and load games from a FAT12 partition, I am a  buyer...

It simply takes too much time for TAPE-IR -ing the EP games  and then loading them from an MP3 player. And, unfortunately, we are not getting any younger either.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2015.December.31. 15:47:16
I am not sure if anyone can help me please.

Yes i can help you StarshipUK and Jolaes76 too!
Next year (2016) will be manufactured the Enterprise 128 SD adapter!

The reason for delay (among other things) is, i have family problems :-/
my mother was in the hospital for months ...

I wish a Happy New Year!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Jolaes76 on 2015.December.31. 17:50:21
Hello Sergej,

we wish your mom a quick recuperation and All of You a Better, happier New Year !
Please notify us when the SD adapters are ready.


Gyors felépülést anyukádnak és mindenkinek egy jobb, boldogabb Új Évet kívánunk!
Szólj ha lesz valami az SD projektből.


üdv.
Zsolt
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: rwap on 2016.February.13. 19:17:37
Segej,

When you have some new SD card interfaces available - could I recommend that you list them on sellmyretro.com - it is slowly becoming the place to buy SD interfaces for a wide range of retro computers!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: tdididit on 2016.February.14. 20:45:45
I would like to buy SD Interface.
Could you put me on next list Sergej ?
:)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: pear on 2016.February.28. 13:51:45
Own baking cover :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2016.February.28. 13:53:48
Cool, I would like one, too. :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: pear on 2016.February.28. 13:59:30
The material is not expensive, but it prints consumes a lot of time.
The housing from photos printed more than 2,5 hours.
So I do not offer prints for sale. Sorry.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2016.February.28. 14:08:56
Quote
So I do not offer prints for sale. Sorry.

:cry: :smt010 :smt022
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2016.February.28. 14:49:00
:cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: pear on 2016.February.28. 14:52:21
Please don't take me for a pity :evil:
I will consider ...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2016.February.28. 14:54:50
Print one for me and one for Z80System then everybody will be happy! :ds_icon_cheesygrin:
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: pear on 2016.February.28. 15:01:47
What color ? For choice: black, gray, light green, red, blue or white ?
The PLA only, because ABS is very smelly :smt120
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2016.February.28. 15:10:20
Quote
What color ? For choice: black, gray, light green, red, blue or white ?

Each one of those ! :)

(Or just the blue ... and green ... and ... :) )

I've choosed: blue.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2016.February.28. 16:22:16
Green!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: StarshipUK on 2016.February.28. 16:56:33
I would still like to buy an SD Adaptor. Does anyone know yet when the next batch will be made please or would be able to sell me a spare one they have that they no longer want.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2016.February.28. 17:06:21
Anybody who would like to order a cartridge SD adapter has to write to SzörG's e-mail address mentioned many times in this topic.

It is SzörG's policy. (He provides the SD cards.)

But the second (or third, it's relative) batch of the SD cards are "late" for a while because of different reasons ... so we wait ...

Along with this process pear beginned to create other type of SD controllers, but that is in the creating phase yet, that is not in production till now.


So, please write an e-mail to SzörG to take you account, but we probably will wait for the SD cards for not really a short time ...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2016.February.28. 17:17:41
Along with this process pear beginned to create other type of SD controllers
SD? Not a CF?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2016.February.28. 17:22:00
Quote
SD? Not a CF?

Sorry, these are the same for me ...

SSD for the EP ! Details (technical ones) are not important ... :)

Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: StarshipUK on 2016.February.28. 17:32:26
I have been asking for one since 2nd September 2014:
https://enterpriseforever.com/hardware/sd-card-interface/msg39813/#msg39813
But for some reason no list of those wanting one was produced so I never got one, and I was never contacted.

There was one listed on EBay but I did not buy it as I thought production of the batch was happening August-September last year as that what had been announced.

It is now around a year since the last batch was made, and still no sign of a new batch so I am asking if anyone else bought one that they are not using that they would be willing to sell.

I like to take my machines to Retro Gaming Events in the UK, to allow other people to use and enjoy the computers. Loading games from tapes takes too long and is not always reliable, so a SD Card or similar device is vital. I have a machine with two joystick adaptors and a working SCART cable. Sadly I am can not take it to events until I manage to obtain a SD Card device. If I do not get a used one, I am very much thinking I am first in the queue to get one if another batch is made, but do not want to be forgotten or miss out again like last time, so making sure I post here to let everyone still know that I want one on a regular basis.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2016.February.28. 18:21:56
Sadly and unfortunately, the situation is this. We have to wait. For a year or for anything.

There is a very rare one, who can do and does production for such a rare machine ...

So when somebody does something, an extension or a device or such, we have to sign in immediately, because that is probably a rare situation,
when a private person's life enables him to make those things he likes, and after some weeks or months the luck is turned,
and the person cannot or would not produce those things for a year or two ...

In these situations we can only wait. (Or learn electronics, but it's a hard one.)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: pear on 2016.February.28. 20:23:15
Blue one (poor lighting).
Need to cut trapping yet.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2016.February.28. 20:27:21
Hmmm ... scary for the firs time ... :)

I just bought a dremel machine for the holes of the EP mobo, maybe I have to use that for finishing ...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: pear on 2016.March.08. 16:45:01
RGB :ds_icon_cheesygrin:
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2016.March.08. 16:49:27
RGB :ds_icon_cheesygrin:
Nice! :-D
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2016.March.08. 18:19:25
Quote
RGB :ds_icon_cheesygrin:

https://youtu.be/SSbBvKaM6sk?t=15
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2016.April.26. 12:23:22
Some news, the SD Adapter Premium PCBs arrived yesterday, and I look forward to other parts.
Please be patient :-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: geco on 2016.April.26. 13:05:17
looks good :), about 20 cards? :D
If you have spare at the end, I would request one also :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: pear on 2016.April.26. 16:00:28
Black series :cool:
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2016.April.26. 20:20:18
Kúlság - kúlság - kúlság ...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2016.April.26. 23:10:24
SDCard image (http://enterprise.iko.hu/SD244MB.zip) updated, F:\START replaced with v. 1.3, EDCW and PAINTBOX replaced with EnterMice compatible version, latest games added.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2016.April.27. 16:40:04
SDCard image (http://enterprise.iko.hu/SD244MB.zip) updated, F:\START replaced with v. 1.3, EDCW and PAINTBOX replaced with EnterMice compatible version, latest games added.


Zozo, have you put the SymbOS with EnterMice mode (https://enterpriseforever.com/programming/symbos-106/?action=dlattach;attach=15397) on the image?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2016.April.28. 23:05:25
Zozo, have you put the SymbOS with EnterMice mode (https://enterpriseforever.com/programming/symbos-106/?action=dlattach;attach=15397) on the image?
Ok, updated.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: StarshipUK on 2016.April.29. 00:05:27
Looks good! Just checking in to confirm I still would like to buy one please from the latest batch when available :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: jltursan on 2016.May.16. 19:38:39
Just noticed this one:

(http://i.imgur.com/056ofp4.png)

How can it be?, is FAT16 (look sdcard0) already supported in EXDOS 1.4 + SDEXT >0.1 or I'm missing something important?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2016.May.16. 19:51:26
Zozo can say you better. FAT16 partitions are detected but not supported... still.

On the other side, Prodatron claims that SymbOS supports natively FAT16 and FAT32 partitions. I don't know if the Enterprise port does it.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2016.May.16. 20:57:19
Just noticed this one:
What needed to see? :oops: It is looks only first pic of video.

Anyway: SD (and IDE) driver are support all FAT type partitions (12/16/16 BIGDOS/16 LBA/32/32 LBA), these are all detected. But the EXDOS currently only support FAT12.

Little note: the curent SDEXT version are 0.3
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: pear on 2016.May.16. 21:03:26
Finally :) Long file names?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: dmacoco on 2016.June.17. 03:34:29

As i'm not expert in electronics, i hope that this batch isn't totally sold.
 i would like to have an sd card interface ; the best way to use our computers..
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: StarshipUK on 2016.July.14. 20:08:16
I just wondered if there are any updates on this exciting project, with it coming up to almost three months since the PCB boards pic was posted. I hope I have not missed anything.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2016.July.26. 09:54:53
yes, i have any news :-)
- the first dose of SD Adapter: in programming and testing phase.
- the second dose: PCB's received.
I ask a little patience. :-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: geco on 2016.July.26. 09:57:35
:smt041 :smt041 :smt041
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2016.July.26. 11:19:13
:smt038
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Jolaes76 on 2016.July.27. 09:23:45
Beautiful :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2016.August.03. 22:06:02
some of programmed SD Adapters :-) the last test is begins...
waiting from few parts (jumpers, sd card sockets, microSD cards) and ready for sending.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: geco on 2016.August.04. 19:58:41
awesome :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: StarshipUK on 2016.August.27. 17:00:37
Please can you let me know how I can buy one when it is ready to purchase. I do not want to miss out on one from this batch, like I did the last batch.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: geco on 2016.August.27. 18:33:38
Please can you let me know how I can buy one when it is ready to purchase. I do not want to miss out on one from this batch, like I did the last batch.
Please write a mail to SzörG.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2016.August.27. 21:27:25
Hi All!

I finished the first batch, now at this time! I have in my hand a hot soldering iron! ;-)
Shiping begin at Monday.

The second batch is 80% complete, if it is full ready then go to programming and testin phase. :-)

Who pre-ordered at last year and this year, will receive the Adapter! :-)

Be patient please! I'm busy with constructing the Adapters, and have no time to watch my emailbox ...

Thx and best regards: SzörG
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: geco on 2016.August.27. 23:40:30
:smt041 :smt041 :smt041
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: StarshipUK on 2016.August.28. 00:21:44
I am really hoping there is more than 23 going to be available, as I am 23rd in the queue, Despite asking for one on this thread back in September 2014 https://enterpriseforever.com/hardware/sd-card-interface/msg39813/#msg39813 :-O
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2016.August.28. 02:02:38
Yes, now there are more than 23 Adapters. :-)
but this year we did not again fulfill manufactured ...

nothing can be done, the third batch shortly in progress! :-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2016.August.31. 10:03:46
"Lot of programs" VHD image (http://enterprise.iko.hu/SD244MB.zip) updated: new programs added: 2048, Chase HQ2 (CPC), Firebow, Lirus, Switchblade, Pacman (CPC). Replaced with new version: Swap, Mozaik, Pasziánsz, Kaszinó, SPEMU. Old, but missing until now: TVC emulator pack
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2016.September.06. 22:08:08
SD ROM version 0.4:
-Internal redesign, now can be used SD and IDE at once. SD and EXDOS ROM can be placed in any order. (Possible use EXDOS ROM from the EXDOS card)
-started redesign the startup screen, replacing the old running debug informations :-) If any key pressed during the SD initialization, then will wait for ESC key at the end

ROM pack version:
FT: standard pack, with Hungarian Quick test screen
FTU: standard pack, with English Quick test screen
FEPD: instead Quick test and Basic, EPDOS 1.9 beta (for machines with upgraded EXOS)
FBRD: instead Quick test, BRD expansion
FESP: instead Quick test, ESP expansion for Spanish users, Gflorez asked it :-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Jungsi on 2016.September.24. 21:55:11
Silly question :-)
I've upgraded to 0.4 - in this case the EXDOS card should work together with the SD Card?
In my case it doesn't work - is there something more to do which I doesn't understand?
hmm...in the German version (BRD) I can stop the boot screen - but ESC doesn't work - I have to do a reset to go to BASIC ;-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2016.September.25. 06:30:42
It can work, but currently needs some trick.
The EXDOS has a bug, it freezes when the floppy controller isn't present. Then the floppy support is disabled in the EXDOS ROM installed to the SD adapter. Then it can be used stand alone.
If you want to use floppy:
-if the EXDOS card uses EXDOS 1.4 then don't install EXDOS ROM to SD (with SDEXT 0.4)
-another way install floppy supported EXDOS to the SD
-if 1.4 is on EXDOS card, then use RL command from Zozotools, replace the EXDOS ROM in the ROM list

Or wait for the bugfixed version, I hope I will create it soon.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2016.September.25. 10:13:28
Ok thanks. This was frequently asked here in Spain.

But I only found the 1.4 EXDOS ROM Hungarian version. Can you put a link?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: pear on 2016.September.25. 18:17:30
Here (https://enterpriseforever.com/hardware/creating-exdos-card-clone/msg46432/#msg46432) is UK version which I used for WD1772 chip.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2016.October.18. 20:32:18
first batch out off, but the second batch started and ready at november :-)
be patient please :-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2016.October.18. 22:14:08
New ROM pack (http://enterprise.iko.hu/SD05.ZIP):
- SDEXT updated to 0.5
- EXDOS updated to final 1.4, now also can handle floppy (previously the floppy support removed, because originaly EXDOS freezee without the floppy controller)
- ROMs with FILE now updated to 1.4, with EnterMice support
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Jungsi on 2016.October.20. 18:15:59
Thanks a lot! Silly question: which one of these do I use for my combination of SD-Card and  floppy interface made by Pear?
The 1772 one? :-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: pear on 2016.October.20. 18:18:37
It may be 1772.
Reading from disk will be slightly faster.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Jungsi on 2016.November.04. 16:34:28
Today I had the time to test it :-)
It's working great - I can now use the EXDOS Card clone by pear together with the SD Card Interface.
Thanks for the good work to you all!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2016.November.10. 20:44:00
ROM pack updated (http://enterprise.iko.hu/SD06.ZIP) with SDEXT 0.6
-SDXC card size now correctly detected
-some vintage MMC cards which were not detected previously, work now

At the ROM pack, ESB Spanish version has been added to Gflorez :-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2016.November.10. 22:32:26
Thanks!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Sdw on 2016.November.24. 16:04:53
I must begin by apologizing if some of the information I am asking about is already mentioned in the thread, 27 pages was a bit too much to read through!

I am currently developing a game for the next EnterpriseDev-compo, and I really need to find a better solution to test my stuff on real HW than making a TAP-file and loading via PC.
If I understand correctly, with this SD-card solution, I could just copy the .COM files from PC to a SD card, pop that into the interface and then the program would be able to load almost instantly on the Enterprise, which would be a big step forward compared to tape-loading times of over a minute.

Some questions:
* Do I need anything else to get it working? Ie. do I need one of those EXDOS things as well, or does this handle everything?
* What is the cost of the SD card interface?
* How do I sign up on the preorder list?
And finally, and perhaps hardest to answer:
* Is there a chance to get one in a reasonable timeframe (ie. in a couple of months time, so I have time to put it to use before the compo deadlie in May)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: geco on 2016.November.24. 16:15:34
Some questions:
* Do I need anything else to get it working? Ie. do I need one of those EXDOS things as well, or does this handle everything?
* What is the cost of the SD card interface?
* How do I sign up on the preorder list?
And finally, and perhaps hardest to answer:
* Is there a chance to get one in a reasonable timeframe (ie. in a couple of months time, so I have time to put it to use before the compo deadlie in May)
If i know well, you do not need anything else, just the adapter with the latest SDEXT ROM, and an SDCARD :)
I do not know exactly, 50-100 Euro
Please write a mail to Szörg, if he says that you should wait too much time, you can ask him to give you mine adapter which will be ready sooner i guess. I will send his mail address in PM.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: geco on 2016.November.24. 16:20:51
I am currently developing a game for the next EnterpriseDev-compo, and I really need to find a better solution to test my stuff on real HW than making a TAP-file and loading via PC.
If I understand correctly, with this SD-card solution, I could just copy the .COM files from PC to a SD card, pop that into the interface and then the program would be able to load almost instantly on the Enterprise, which would be a big step forward compared to tape-loading times of over a minute.
EP128emu is very good, I do not remember that we had any program which ran on EP128emu, and did not run on real HW (except one which was written by IstvánV and used undocumented dave trick for timing), so testing on real hw is enough at the end of development normally :)
Yes, you just have to drop the files into your SDCARD, and you can load it on a real EP.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2016.November.24. 16:23:03
If I understand correctly, with this SD-card solution, I could just copy the .COM files from PC to a SD card, pop that into the interface and then the program would be able to load almost instantly on the Enterprise
Yes.


Quote
* Do I need anything else to get it working?
No.

Quote
* What is the cost of the SD card interface?
* How do I sign up on the preorder list?
And finally, and perhaps hardest to answer:
* Is there a chance to get one in a reasonable timeframe (ie. in a couple of months time, so I have time to put it to use before the compo deadlie in May)
Ask SzörG.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Sdw on 2016.November.24. 16:30:12
If i know well, you do not need anything else, just the adapter with the latest SDEXT ROM, and an SDCARD :)
I do not know exactly, 50-100 Euro
Please write a mail to Szörg, if he says that you should wait too much time, you can ask him to give you mine adapter which will be ready sooner i guess. I will send his mail address in PM.

Thank you for the information (and the very kind offer to let me take your queue spot if things take too long time)!
I have written a mail, and will see what he says.

Quote
EP128emu is very good, I do not remember that we had any program which ran on EP128emu, and did not run on real HW (except one which was written by IstvánV and used undocumented dave trick for timing), so testing on real hw is enough at the end of development normally :)
Yes, you just have to drop the files into your SDCARD, and you can load it on a real EP.

Yeah, that is my experience as well, I don't think I ever had anything that worked in emu not work on real HW during the development of "First Contact".
Still, I usually test on real HW every day I have done some developing, things tend to look a bit different on a real CRT-TV compared to on a PC screen in emulator (colors/brightness etc.) and also things move smoother with a real perfect 50Hz sync that you don't get on emu.
Also, for me, seeing things work on real hardware always feels better than an emulator window! :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2016.November.24. 16:38:46
Also, for me, seeing things work on real hardware always feels better than an emulator window! :)
Yes!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: IstvanV on 2016.November.24. 18:45:08
and also things move smoother with a real perfect 50Hz sync that you don't get on emu.

It depends on whether you have a 50 or 100 Hz monitor. :) Although even then it is not exactly the same frequency, it works well in the double buffered mode.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2016.December.02. 10:00:09
The "lot of programs" disk image updated. (http://enterprise.iko.hu/SD244MB.zip)
-START file and Bricky Prise updated to mouse version
-Runner game from Endi
-Core and Kscope demos from g0blinish
-because out of free space on Demo partition then the Interlace slideshow 2 moved to Media partition
-the missing Christmas slideshow added to demos (Christmas is coming soon :-) )
-lot of free space on Util partition then added there the missing Interlace slideshow 3 :-)
-added to PT3 collection 3 music which is used in Lirus

Most important: SymbOS updated to latest, it is fully support the EnterMice mouse (both buttun and wheel are working), and now can play music on Enterprise
There are 4 INI files, with .SD extensions for a normal size SD card, the .MSD extensions for Micro SD and emulator.
Named as SYMBOS for standard 128K machines, SYMEXT for expanded machines, theres is a desktop background image, and enabled the Extended Desktop. Which is right for your configuration then needed to copy as SYMBOS.INI. Default are SYMEXT.MSD: Micro SD/emulator, with expanded machine.
Music added to SYMBOS-2 (G:) partition.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: sinclair200 on 2016.December.16. 14:44:21
Waiting for the SzörG adapter I already have the casing made in 3D......

(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/13583266/Cartucho%20Basic%203D/IMG_3390.JPG)
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/13583266/Cartucho%20Basic%203D/IMG_3391.JPG)
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/13583266/Cartucho%20Basic%203D/IMG_3392.JPG)
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/13583266/Cartucho%20Basic%203D/IMG_3386.JPG)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Povi on 2016.December.16. 15:30:31
nice!

a nice sticker would be great on the box of the SD-reader! :-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: geco on 2016.December.16. 16:20:50
Cool, like an original EP64 Basic cartridge, congrat :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2016.December.16. 18:44:58
He owns a 128, not a 64. the sticker is made by himself from a scan he found on Internet.

I got from him two of them for my cartridges.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: sinclair200 on 2016.December.16. 19:25:04
nice!

a nice sticker would be great on the box of the SD-reader! :-)

In it I am ..... hahaha
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2016.December.16. 21:19:39
I think he wants to say "indeed, I am workin in it"
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: sinclair200 on 2016.December.17. 11:19:08
Done Tag
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/13583266/Cartucho%20Basic%203D/IMG_3397.JPG)
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/13583266/Cartucho%20Basic%203D/IMG_3398.JPG)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2016.December.17. 15:08:43
Gorgeous!

----------
 ¡De lujo!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2016.December.18. 23:51:49
nice job ! :-) fantastic!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: sinclair200 on 2016.December.19. 01:20:48
Thank you, partner, looking forward to receiving the card ......
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2017.January.17. 12:15:42
The "lot of programs" .VHD file (http://enterprise.iko.hu/SD244MB.zip) updated again.
Added Wolf2004, Hobbit, Squares.
SID Player updated.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: sinclair200 on 2017.January.21. 19:47:50
nice job ! :-) fantastic!

Hi SzörG, it takes a long time for my SD interface ?
A greeting....
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2017.January.22. 11:59:00
Hi All!

We modified the SD Adapter PCB (two indicator LED), and now come a few pieces for a test.
If it works well, then i prodece a lot ...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Tutus on 2017.January.22. 12:20:24
Hi All!

We modified the SD Adapter PCB (two indicator LED), and now come a few pieces for a test.
If it works well, then i prodece a lot ...

:smt038 :smt038 :smt038
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: geco on 2017.January.22. 13:08:20
:smt041 :smt041 :smt041
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Judge on 2017.January.25. 19:28:04
:smt026 I'm looking forward to it!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2017.January.25. 22:52:17
Stay tuned dudes, a few weeks and done :-)
I waiting for some patrs, Xilinx IC etc...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: sinclair200 on 2017.February.08. 14:31:44
What a nerves.......
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: ricco59 on 2017.February.16. 13:19:57
Hi

I'm waiting for it toooooo. I would like to show it here in France during AC2017 next to tandy coco3 and acorn archimedes 3010 :)

Continue your Nice, Great, Fantastic job

Eric
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: tofro on 2017.April.11. 13:53:09
As a soon-to-be owner of an EP128 I would also be heavily interested in the SD-card interface.

Tobias
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Eamonshoot on 2017.April.15. 10:24:38
Me too! Just got hold of an Enterprise 128 - definitely interested in an SD card interface for it.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: geco on 2017.April.15. 11:16:36
Me too! Just got hold of an Enterprise 128 - definitely interested in an SD card interface for it.
Please write a mail to Szörg, if I remember well he asked it for new requests, probably he does not miss any requests in forum flow :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Eamonshoot on 2017.April.15. 13:48:30
Please write a mail to Szörg, if I remember well he asked it for new requests, probably he does not miss any requests in forum flow :)

Thanks for the advice - just sent him a PM
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2017.October.10. 20:27:28
Hi All !

I am here again! :-)

I'm waiting for the PCBs of SD Adapter REV3, but now it's really!
I ordered a lot of quantities from this :-) there will be no more shortage!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: ricco59 on 2017.October.10. 21:48:00
Hi

It's really a good news

CU
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Dr.OG on 2017.October.11. 06:40:37
Awesome, I was looking forward to it since the first announcement!

Szuper, vártam már nagyon!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: tofro on 2017.October.11. 08:24:29
Hey, great news!

Tobias
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: jackleather on 2017.October.28. 17:43:13
I'd like to order one - please add me to the list!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: chouimat on 2017.October.29. 20:25:54
'd like to order one - please add me to the list!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2017.November.02. 23:35:43
Chouimat & jackleather ! thanks for Your preorder, the SD Adapter's production is in progress :-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: wilco2009 on 2017.November.22. 12:33:30
I am interested in one SD Card interface, please add me to the list.

What is the price of the card?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: tofro on 2017.November.22. 23:35:46
I have sent you a PM some time ago - Interest in the SD interface is still there.

Tobias
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: ricco59 on 2017.November.25. 18:31:40
Hi

Me too. Hope you don't forget me ;)

see you
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2017.November.25. 21:00:16
Hi All!

the PCB's and some parts have arrived :-) this is the good news with SD Adapter.

some adapter will be prepared this year, but now I'm going to move and my stuff is half packed in cardboard boxes ...
so it will not go fully :-)

I will return if I can post!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: msch on 2017.December.03. 10:19:30
I am still interested in the SD Card interface, please add me to the list.
Cheers,
Mathias
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2017.December.03. 11:49:24
Quote
I am still interested in the SD Card interface, please add me to the list.

Mostly SzörG accepts the registrations through his e-mail.
So if you got an answer in e-mail, you are on the list.


Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: John Fante on 2018.July.18. 16:44:28
Sorry to wake an old topic, but is there any news in the rev 3 boards? :-)

I wrote a email to SzörG gmail account (hope that is the correct) but have not heard back.

Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2018.November.07. 12:10:59
Hi All!

I came back ...
Will continue the fight with the old pre-order list ... :shock:
I hope will be up to date soon! :-)

New pre-order only to mine email please! vortyex at gmail dot com
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: pear on 2018.November.07. 13:00:15
I'm on the waiting list ? Or do I have to write a new email ?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2018.November.07. 19:26:43
It looks better and better at every incarnation ... :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2018.November.08. 09:52:51
Hi Pear!

I'm looking at the end of 2016 - early 2017 period in preorder :-/

I ask for your patience ...

I'm on the waiting list ? Or do I have to write a new email ?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2018.November.08. 09:55:24
The next reincarnation will be in early 2019 ... with REV 4. verison!

It looks better and better at every incarnation ... :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Dr.OG on 2018.November.08. 11:07:59
...
I'm looking at the end of 2016 - early 2017 period in preorder :-/
...
I preordered mine via E-mail on 20/FEB/2017, hope it fits into that time period...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2018.November.08. 19:57:02
I do not know where my preordered ones are in the list,
but put my ones at the end of the list.

Let those ones get it first,
who do not have a single SD controller, yet.


One SD card to everyone ! (At least ... :))
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2018.November.13. 14:10:47
8 new SD-Readers have arrived to Spain....


[attach=1]
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: pear on 2018.November.13. 15:01:12
Lucky beggar :D
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2018.November.13. 16:01:12
SzörG sent them yesterday by UPS. Less than a day for only 25 Euros shipping.

But this order is from April 2016...

After so many problems on his private life, SzörG claims  he wants to short the waiting list up to date very fast.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: pear on 2018.November.13. 16:28:36
I know, I know, I'm happy with your happiness :)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2018.November.13. 16:30:05
Hm :-) the pre-order list is very long after one year break!
I'm doing this since two business days and it's never over ...

so please patiently with new orders!

The next dose will be in January 2019! and there will be two different adapters Rev3 and Rev4 !!!

stay tune! ;-)
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: gflorez on 2018.November.13. 18:05:13
This is the list of the new owners of SD-readers, some of them users of this web:

gflorez(my second unit)
ron
groovydrifter
Nodoyuna
Sinclair200
Wilco2009
Dandare
Flopping

Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Dr.OG on 2018.November.13. 19:13:48
Mine arrived today, it's a V3 with red PCB, and works flawless! Very nice piece of hardware, fits perfectly in the original BASIC cartridge's case using microSD card!

Thanks again!!!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: dangerman on 2018.November.13. 23:44:50
Mine arrived today too. It's fantastic :ds_icon_cheesygrin: 

Everything fits into the cartridge slot - EXDOS, BASIC and an SD card with 1000s of software titles!!!

Love it.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Z80System on 2018.November.14. 22:23:38
Quote
Everything fits into the cartridge slot - EXDOS, BASIC and an SD card with 1000s of software titles!!!

You got the feeling ... :)

Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: ron on 2018.November.18. 10:08:54
Hello ! Enterists * ( ha ha ! ;-) )

I have an issue with the SPEMU and the SD interface, both in 48K and 128 versions. My Enterprise is extended to 576KB, I have the latest ROM versions but it does not let me load neither TAP nor SNA. It stucks in the file selector screen ( no way to select a file ) even when I try to do it from any of the SD partitions.

On the other hand, if I do it from floppy or Gotek it works without any problem. Does something similar happen to you?

My SD is one of the last that Szörg has sent to GFlorez.

Thx a lot ! Cheers !
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: geco on 2018.November.18. 11:38:58
Hello Ron

There is a bug in the SPEMU file handling, if there are too much file in the folder then it cause problems in file selection, if i remember well ,i corrected it, please try to download the latest versions.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2018.November.18. 12:17:58
if i remember well ,i corrected it, please try to download the latest versions.
Where is it? I also waiting for the corrected version :oops:
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2018.December.09. 20:33:50
Hi All!
Only 2018 pre-orders remained in pending. :-)
I'll be back in January 2019!
until then a little evolution of SD Adapter ...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Judge on 2018.December.09. 21:53:30
What the function of the battery on the last PCB?
I don't have this on mine.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Dr.OG on 2018.December.10. 06:12:30
Mine does not have either, but I don't mind, battery leaking is a PCB killer... Many Amiga 500+ < died for this reason...
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Judge on 2018.December.10. 08:46:35
Okay, but what's his function?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2018.December.10. 10:23:37
battery leaking is a PCB killer... Many Amiga 500+ < died for this reason...
Na erre csak magyarul tudom a választ :oops:
Az Amigákat (és a régi PC alaplapokat) aksi (NiCd, főleg Varta gyártmány) öli meg, ez meg gombelem.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2018.December.10. 10:23:48
Okay, but what's his function?
RTC
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Judge on 2018.December.10. 10:38:02
RTC

Kicsit bővebben?!
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2018.December.10. 10:39:33
Kicsit bővebben?!
Real Time Clock
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Judge on 2018.December.10. 10:44:07
Real Time Clock

Hacsak úgy nem! OK.  :oops:
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Dr.OG on 2018.December.10. 16:20:07
Na erre csak magyarul tudom a választ :oops:
Az Amigákat (és a régi PC alaplapokat) aksi (NiCd, főleg Varta gyártmány) öli meg, ez meg gombelem.
És ez, ha szétfolyik, nem marja a NyÁK-ot?

Does it not harm the PCB in case of leaking?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Judge on 2018.December.10. 20:08:44
És ez, ha szétfolyik, nem marja a NyÁK-ot?

Does it not harm the PCB in case of leaking?

Én nagyon rég óta szerelek PC alaplapokat. Van itt sok régi is. De még nem láttam egyetlen kifolyt gombelemet sem.

I'm installing PC motherboards from a long time ago. There are many old ones here too. But I have not seen one  leaked button batteries.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: dangerman on 2018.December.10. 22:37:26
I think round lithium batteries (like the one on the SD card board) aren't bad for leaking.

The problem batteries are the old NiCd and NiMH batteries - they leak and cause damage to old motherboards :(

Great to see that the SD card interface keeps getting better.
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2018.December.31. 23:34:02
Real Time Clock
Coming soon: ZozoTools Clock included to SD ROM
[attach=1][attach=2]

Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: BruceTanner on 2019.January.01. 19:42:18
Coming soon: ZozoTools Clock included to SD ROM
Which bit of the ROM does it go in? How many bytes (v.approx)?

You know why I'm asking :mrgreen:
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Zozosoft on 2019.January.01. 20:12:11
Which bit of the ROM does it go in? How many bytes (v.approx)?
It is placed to Segment 04h with the memory test, :FILE, etc
Also made a EXOS 2.4 where at the Segment 02h

Quote
You know why I'm asking :mrgreen:
Yes :ds_icon_cheesygrin:
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: Trefe on 2019.January.02. 21:45:11
Ó! Ezen a témán én decemberben átszaladtam és most csak pislogok! Mit is takar az az RTC? Vagyis tudom mi az, csak ezen a  kártyán mit jelent? Az enyémen még nincs. Szoftveres, vagyis pótolható, vagy hardveres és kell egy újat rendelnem, mert engem érdekel?
Title: Re: SD card interface
Post by: SzörG on 2019.January.03. 13:41:30
Ó! Ezen a témán én decemberben átszaladtam és most csak pislogok! Mit is takar az az RTC? Vagyis tudom mi az, csak ezen a  kártyán mit jelent? Az enyémen még nincs. Szoftveres, vagyis pótolható, vagy hardveres és kell egy újat rendelnem, mert engem érdekel?

Ezzel a Rev 4-es új verzióval kb. már elértük a kihasználható lehetőségek plafonját ezen a bővítőporton, úgy sejtem rev5 nem lesz.
valós idejű óra hardveres és szoftveres megoldás kombinációja és az új verzión lesz elérhető.

I think ... the Rev4 Sd Adapter (Premium version LED - RTC) will be the final version of this hardware! :-)